Turbo & Supercharge (Forced Induction) Posts regarding Turbochargers, Superchargers and any other method for Forced Induction.

Tibchic's Turbo Project! *work In Progress*

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Old Jul 3, 2009 | 06:31 AM
  #91  
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You may want to not use fram oil filters. They are no longer made by Wix anymore and have become VERY subpar. Do a google search on them and you will see.

other then that looks good.
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Old Jul 3, 2009 | 07:40 AM
  #92  
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Yeah very niiice
I like the simple exhaust
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Old Jul 4, 2009 | 10:36 AM
  #93  
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the exhaust looks amazing..the pictures do not do it justice at all..you have to see it up on a lift to fully appreciate it. especailly the back section over the axle.


So yeah...tuning this thing is going to be fun...
we didnt do enough logging before we added the turbo parts on, so i had to interpolate some of the maf sensor voltages in the FIC maf table. and its causing problems.
I need to buy an obd2 scan too to monitor short and long term fuel trims, so i can figure out what to modifiy the front and rear o2 sensor voltages by so the car doesn't "fight" the tuning so to speak at idle/light load.

Melissa didn't wire her o2 sensors into the FIC to begin with, so she has to take her dash apart again and get those soldered in..or else its really useless spending time on it, because the car tries to adjust away all the changes i am making.

http://forum.aempower.com/forum/inde...c,22476.0.html update link for firm ware

however...i read this a few posts down..it seems like he is saying, you do NOT update to version 3 if you are running on a hyundai. dmdicks? anyone else, what did you do?
here is the quote i am trying to interpret.
QUOTE
here's some clarification:
The FIC uses two chips, the main chip (x300.hex) handles some things and the slave chip (z104.hex or z110.hex) handles other things. Among other things, the slave chip handles the injector measurement and control strategy.

For instance, if you plan to install the FIC in most Dodge/Chrysler, Mazda or Hyundai vehicles, you will need to flash the slave chip to z110.hex firmware. If you plan to use the new V3 software, you will need to flash the main chip to x300.hex.

so in th elast line is he saying that hyundais CANT use version three..? or they can? and if they do then update the and flash the main chip? that statement confused the shit out of me.

Resources
AEMLog-http://forum.aempower.com/forum/index.php/topic,23299.0.html
*used to view logs we took when car was NA, to figure out maf max and min voltages for MAF clamp table.
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Old Jul 4, 2009 | 10:46 AM
  #94  
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Why would you need any adjustments for idle and light load? Leaving the stock ECU to dither around 14.7AFR seems like the best thing to do..

The only thing you need to modify O2 signals for is part-load which is high enough to build some boost but not high enough to make the ECU run in open-loop. I *think* you can intercept the TPS signal with Analog A in/outs and "fake" a high TPS value whenever there is boost, forcing the ECU into open-loop mode (i'm guessing that's what AtelierHP turbo box does)

And what is that about the MAF voltages? Why don't you just leave them alone? Just clamp it to 4.4v

I don't remember which firmware version I used, I tried a few I think. I am able to use the latest software though.
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Old Jul 4, 2009 | 12:24 PM
  #95  
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let me answer your questions as best i can.

QUOTE (radu_rd2 @ Jul 4 2009, 01:46 PM)
Why would you need any adjustments for idle and light load? Leaving the stock ECU to dither around 14.7AFR seems like the best thing to do..
I need to make adjustments in the fuel table percentages because of the larger injectors. In order to figure out what therhetical 14.7 is, i need to adjust the fuel percentages in the fuel map, until the obd2 scan tool short term fuel trim (STFT) reads close to zero. An initial calculation of old injector to new injector size is about -44%, however to check i need to monitor the fuel trims to see how had the o2 sensors are working to get the car to idle at 14.7, this is what i meant by adjusting at idle and light load because of injector resize

The only thing you need to modify O2 signals for is part-load which is high enough to build some boost but not high enough to make the ECU run in open-loop.
i agree 100%, for idle i just need to monitor them to find out what percentages to decrease my fuel tables by to adjust for the new bigger injectors.

I *think* you can intercept the TPS signal with Analog A in/outs and "fake" a high TPS value whenever there is boost, forcing the ECU into open-loop mode (i'm guessing that's what AtelierHP turbo box does)
This is an interesting idea..however i would be concerned about what other effects this has on the ecu's routine, maybe it works great..but the begging question is...why not just intercept tpc and then for the Entire map, fake a tps of 100% to go into open loop. unplug o2 sensors, and tune the car in open loop and never have to worry about the stock o2 sensors again?Seems too easy to just do that?

And what is that about the MAF voltages? Why don't you just leave them alone? Just clamp it to 4.4v
The problem is..to clamp the maf voltages in FIC, you have to go into the setup, and choose mode =voltage. When you do that, you cannot have zeros in the maf map anymore..because that will mean 0 voltage, not zero percent. So i need to have positive maf voltages in that entire maf map. If i just put 4.4 in every cell in the maf map, the car will think the maf sensor is reading 4.4 volts, and the the result will be that even at idle that ecu will think its 4.4 volts, and will start dumping a shit tonne of fuel causing it to flood. Thats why your only supposed to clamp the voltages to say 4.4 above a certain level. You want to get your maf voltage in your maf map (taken from your logs when the car was NA) as close as possible to what the maf voltages actually are, so the fueling wont be much off to begin with. you want to minize variables that are chaning your fueling.

I don't remember which firmware version I used, I tried a few I think. I am able to use the latest software though.
i emailed aem about this, and ill post back with their reply. I thought..and so it sounds from the admins post..that hyundais needed a special slave version to deal with fueling issues where sometimes the car would go extremly lean because of how the stock ecu did something with the injector pulse widths under certain conditions. Other then that i have no idea if i should be runing ver 3, or the other hex version.



im understanding this more and more as i read..but there are still a few questions..after i nail it, i'll make a fic tuning turotial to help everyone out, since it would have been useful for us to have.

As for right now were goig to get the o2 sensors wired in, and get the obd2 scan tool hooked up.

thanks for your reply radu, it helped me try to sort things out in my own head alot.

okay just wanted to add this..

I know what to do know for reflashing.

Update the software to newest version via the link i posted above.

This will require a reflash for most people.

1.take power away from fic, unplug usb cable.
2.go to file menu, hit get slave version.
3.follow instructions there
4. now go to file menu and flash fic, for this first time choose the x300.hex file...this is for the Main chip on the FIC, its software and firmware related.
5. do same process as you did when getting slave version, however this time it will actually flash the main chip with the X hex file on it to the newest ver 3 one.
6. now you have to flash the FIC with the fuel hex file appropriate for the hyundais, which is the Z file called z110.hex. Which is what the admin meant in the other post.
7. do the same procedure as you just did for reflashing ht main chip, except this time its going to reflash your slave chip which controls fuel.

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Old Jul 4, 2009 | 05:46 PM
  #96  
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I doubt forcing it in open-loop mode all the time would work. Frankly I wouldn't want that, I want the ECU to automatically adjust and keep 14.7 AFR at idle and cruising.

For the fuel map, just start with the computed map (right click, create base map, and enter the old and new injector sizes) and go from there. Yes, monitoring the fuel trims is a good idea, you want to shoot for a near 0% long term trim. STFT will vary a lot because of dithering around 14.7 AFR. I have about +10% LTFT with base computed map, even though I increased fuel pressure a bit over stock, but it works fine so whatever.

For the MAF map, forget everything you said lol. Just leave the empty MAF map (percent mode, full of 0s) and clamp the max voltage to 4.4v from the configuration screen ("max voltage clamp" under "MAF"). If you didn't know that you can clamp it from the configuration screen, READ THE MANUAL cause that's like the first thing it tells you to do tongue.gif
By the way, even if there was no clamp option, you could have had the MAF map set up on voltage BUT with MAF as the input (configuration, "load input"), and most of the map would be a mirror of the input, except for higher voltages where you'd have 4.4v
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Old Jul 5, 2009 | 10:26 AM
  #97  
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the major differences between the trannies are the syncros...beta i has single cone, beta II map based has double cone, and 04-08 have triple cone (maf cvvt)

and i would be using an OEM filter.
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Old Jul 6, 2009 | 06:22 AM
  #98  
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yeah radu i know about the max voltage on the maf setup screen, i had it set to 5 volts, and the rest of the maf map set to zero's in percent mode. We did this without the obd2 scan tool, i ordered one but it wont be here until tuesday. The car drives and afr is 14.5-14.7 part throttle driving, and with a few adjustments...and i mean very few, under boost its 11.3-11.5, under boost for now. I'll lower it from 5 to 4.65 which is the max value we seen before turbo was installed.

Something doesn't sound right with the car though.it may be the length of the dump tube, or the wastegate...
we had a problem with the wastegate opening at idle..the valve in the wastegate had some rough machined edges, we cleaned them up and put it back together and its not sticking open anymore.

The spring sees 5.4 psi max boost. It reachers 5psi by like 3200 rpm.

The BOV is giving us some grief. It doesn't appear to be opening even with that tensioner spring backed all the way off..i tee'd into a larger vaccum source off the intake manifold. still no change. I checked the valve its oepning when pressed, no sticking..i lubricated it as well.

I am running conservative timing numbers, a basic 1* per psi retard on igntion for right now. The first night we had it out, the car seemed to run quite good (depspite the strange wastegate noise). Then when the car was idling the CEL came on (which it was doing before the car was turbo charged too) and it hasnt seem to run the same. So we'll get the scanner on it to see what code its throwing..
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Old Jul 6, 2009 | 06:35 AM
  #99  
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Sounds like the tuning is spot on then.

Just a note which might be helpful: the max MAF value I saw N/A was about 4.4v. I first tried clamping it to 4.8v but I would get this strange random leaning out under WOT - ECU would sometimes decrease fuel severely for a little while. I decreased the clamp the 4.6v and it still did it but noticeably less. I finally tried 4.45v and the issue stopped. Another person (ScoupeLS) reported that setting the clamp value to 4.45v solved his random leaning out as well.
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Old Jul 6, 2009 | 08:10 AM
  #100  
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For 5psi I wouldn't do anything at all with the timing. I wouldn't start doing any sort of retard till after 10psi. One thing to note about Max MAF values is that proximity to sea level will greatly affect what max voltage you'll reach Normally Aspirated.
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