turbo vs supercharger
09-24-2002, 04:48 AM
#41
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Sorry about not replying earlier, but have been kinda busy...
...and thank you Shadohh...you kinda took the words out of my mouth...
I can't change the past (nor was I even involved in the earlier kit dealings), but wanted to give you guys a little background on me (didn't mean to bore some of you or sound like an old pompous windbag bragging about past accomplishments), and was hoping to instead give you some insight as to why Alpine hired me to run their operations here. Hell...had I known the job came with all this "brouhaha" about problems with kits previous sold here, I might not have taken this job---well maybe...
...and Tony, if it does sound like John's words being typed by me, understand that even though there's "two sides to every story", his side pays my salary, and what kind of loyal employee would I be if I didn't defend their side?
My point is, that Alpine DOES want to offer kits that are of VALUE to the consumer, and as long as I'm in charge of their U.S offices, I will do everything I possibly and professionally can to solve all existing problems, and work on improving the quality and performance of our kits. Hence the reason for "airing" this on a public forum. I WANT everyone to know we ARE trying, and believe your feedback and approval are integral in Alpine Developments being successful in this market place.
I know and understand the need for pertinent and accurate information and numbers when it comes to an expensive performance product like ours (let's face it, this is not like just bolting on a muffler). I can't change everything overnight, but am making progress in getting our parent office to understand what this market "demands" (have already tried to clarify on our end with that follow-up clarification e-mail Tony posted), and have requested clarification be added to our website (and will notify you all when changed).
I will be the first to admit I am not a "turbo guru" or an engineer, and won't always have answers at my fingertips, but I DO know how to find those answers (Red...interested in a job?---I'm not kidding!!!!).
Is our 2.0L kit perfect? Are the performance numbers posted on our site relevant to U.S vehicles? Of course not! How will we fix it? I don't know yet, but I assure you that if we can improve on the kit here on U.S. vehicles, we will. We are picking up a 2.0L Elantra tomorrow (from Hyundai) to start our test fittings, and tuning (for both the supercharger and turbo kits) to get you dyno figures on U.S. somgged cars, using U.S 91 octane gas, and since we are working with HKS on a collaborative effort for our 2.7L application (possible stage one & two performance upgrades), may even seek their help in simplifying and a more concise way of tuning both of the 2.0L kits. We will be looking at the suggestions from you guys (loose the 5th injector, going to larger injector replacements--finding something else that can do the Unichips job better and easier), as well, and anything else you guys can think of.
We are not actively promoting or selling the 2.0L applications, until we get the "bugs" worked out, and get Maurice's car (still not happy) and both of Tony's cars tuned right. Once I feel comfortable with the kits (meaning I'd put it on my car), we'll schedule for CARB testing, and keep this board appraised of certification, and then I'll start promoting the hell out of it!
In the meantime, all I ask is that you be patient (only two full-time employees here at the moment), address any problems or concerns to us directly, and we will do whatever it takes to try and get resolved in as timely a manner as possible.
Thanks for letting me get that off my chest!
Steve
P.S. Tony...call me! We may be able to get one of your cars in here before the end of the week!
[ September 24, 2002, 01:03 PM: Message edited by: ballrub ]
...and thank you Shadohh...you kinda took the words out of my mouth...
I can't change the past (nor was I even involved in the earlier kit dealings), but wanted to give you guys a little background on me (didn't mean to bore some of you or sound like an old pompous windbag bragging about past accomplishments), and was hoping to instead give you some insight as to why Alpine hired me to run their operations here. Hell...had I known the job came with all this "brouhaha" about problems with kits previous sold here, I might not have taken this job---well maybe...
...and Tony, if it does sound like John's words being typed by me, understand that even though there's "two sides to every story", his side pays my salary, and what kind of loyal employee would I be if I didn't defend their side?
My point is, that Alpine DOES want to offer kits that are of VALUE to the consumer, and as long as I'm in charge of their U.S offices, I will do everything I possibly and professionally can to solve all existing problems, and work on improving the quality and performance of our kits. Hence the reason for "airing" this on a public forum. I WANT everyone to know we ARE trying, and believe your feedback and approval are integral in Alpine Developments being successful in this market place.
I know and understand the need for pertinent and accurate information and numbers when it comes to an expensive performance product like ours (let's face it, this is not like just bolting on a muffler). I can't change everything overnight, but am making progress in getting our parent office to understand what this market "demands" (have already tried to clarify on our end with that follow-up clarification e-mail Tony posted), and have requested clarification be added to our website (and will notify you all when changed).
I will be the first to admit I am not a "turbo guru" or an engineer, and won't always have answers at my fingertips, but I DO know how to find those answers (Red...interested in a job?---I'm not kidding!!!!).
Is our 2.0L kit perfect? Are the performance numbers posted on our site relevant to U.S vehicles? Of course not! How will we fix it? I don't know yet, but I assure you that if we can improve on the kit here on U.S. vehicles, we will. We are picking up a 2.0L Elantra tomorrow (from Hyundai) to start our test fittings, and tuning (for both the supercharger and turbo kits) to get you dyno figures on U.S. somgged cars, using U.S 91 octane gas, and since we are working with HKS on a collaborative effort for our 2.7L application (possible stage one & two performance upgrades), may even seek their help in simplifying and a more concise way of tuning both of the 2.0L kits. We will be looking at the suggestions from you guys (loose the 5th injector, going to larger injector replacements--finding something else that can do the Unichips job better and easier), as well, and anything else you guys can think of.
We are not actively promoting or selling the 2.0L applications, until we get the "bugs" worked out, and get Maurice's car (still not happy) and both of Tony's cars tuned right. Once I feel comfortable with the kits (meaning I'd put it on my car), we'll schedule for CARB testing, and keep this board appraised of certification, and then I'll start promoting the hell out of it!
In the meantime, all I ask is that you be patient (only two full-time employees here at the moment), address any problems or concerns to us directly, and we will do whatever it takes to try and get resolved in as timely a manner as possible.
Thanks for letting me get that off my chest!
Steve
P.S. Tony...call me! We may be able to get one of your cars in here before the end of the week!
[ September 24, 2002, 01:03 PM: Message edited by: ballrub ]
09-24-2002, 05:54 AM
#42
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Red working for alpine?
Just doesnt click in right.... im pretty sure of his answer....
BUT
it would be kool to have him in LA
But yes balrub... ditch the 5th injector
Im a nitrous moderator in some places and i strongly advise those who ask not to go over a 100shot via a fogger nozzle simply because the same theory is applied.
I will also prove the weakness of the 5th injector in my setup
Same stuff... but without the spacer or the 5th injector
I just hope the dam unichip can get my car to idle right
BTW ballrub... You still have not taken up my invitation to one of our meets
wink
Just doesnt click in right.... im pretty sure of his answer....
BUT
it would be kool to have him in LA
But yes balrub... ditch the 5th injector
Im a nitrous moderator in some places and i strongly advise those who ask not to go over a 100shot via a fogger nozzle simply because the same theory is applied.
I will also prove the weakness of the 5th injector in my setup
Same stuff... but without the spacer or the 5th injector
I just hope the dam unichip can get my car to idle right
BTW ballrub... You still have not taken up my invitation to one of our meets
wink
09-24-2002, 06:24 AM
#43
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Yeah, saw that. I don't think you guys are offering enough money for me to move to California wink especially considering my current job situation.
In any case, if you guys want some suggestions or comments, I'm more than happy to help. Doesn't mean we'll always agree on the final outcome, but I still don't mind offering my $0.02 if needed.
I think the UniChip is a fine method of tuning, the only problem here is the tuning that your particular UniChip is coming with doesn't match the setup on the US-spec cars. Tuning one of these Unichip devices cannot possibly be harder than tuning my own Haltech setup; if I had the software and/or equipment, I wouldn't mind taking a stab at it.
In any case, as I said before, I've had no problem recommending this setup as a good base. My suggestions have always been focused on replacing the "tuning" components of your kit (the UniChip) with something that the end-user can actually adjust without having to drive several hundred miles. Thus, my suggestion for them to scrap the UniChip, 5th injector and head spacer, and instead replace them with an S-AFC, a set of 440cc injectors and an MSD ignitioin with the BTM.
If you got the UniChip tuning right and swapped for four bigger injectors, none of that would be necessary smile.gif
I know UFB can make you a great deal on some 370cc or even 550cc injectors for cheap which are compatible with the stock ECU (electrically). May not have to bump the price of the kit if you can source them inexpensively...
In any case, if you guys want some suggestions or comments, I'm more than happy to help. Doesn't mean we'll always agree on the final outcome, but I still don't mind offering my $0.02 if needed.
I think the UniChip is a fine method of tuning, the only problem here is the tuning that your particular UniChip is coming with doesn't match the setup on the US-spec cars. Tuning one of these Unichip devices cannot possibly be harder than tuning my own Haltech setup; if I had the software and/or equipment, I wouldn't mind taking a stab at it.
In any case, as I said before, I've had no problem recommending this setup as a good base. My suggestions have always been focused on replacing the "tuning" components of your kit (the UniChip) with something that the end-user can actually adjust without having to drive several hundred miles. Thus, my suggestion for them to scrap the UniChip, 5th injector and head spacer, and instead replace them with an S-AFC, a set of 440cc injectors and an MSD ignitioin with the BTM.
If you got the UniChip tuning right and swapped for four bigger injectors, none of that would be necessary smile.gif
I know UFB can make you a great deal on some 370cc or even 550cc injectors for cheap which are compatible with the stock ECU (electrically). May not have to bump the price of the kit if you can source them inexpensively...
09-24-2002, 06:47 AM
#44
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QUOTE
Red:
if I had the software and/or equipment, I wouldn't mind taking a stab at it.
Call the racers groupif I had the software and/or equipment, I wouldn't mind taking a stab at it.
Get the dam cable and program... drive your happy Maxima ass to LA and you can take a stab at making a tibby idle right with some 550cc's
wink
tongue.gif
09-24-2002, 07:01 AM
#45
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Vehicle: 2008 Toyota Prius 2006 Suzuki SV650S
I tried this route with Dastek.
They refused to sell me the cable and software to tune the unichip.
Maybe working with Red, Ballrub, and Tony from the racers group, we could actually make it happen.
I've been DYING to try to get this thing tuned right....*hops from foot to foot with anticipation*
They refused to sell me the cable and software to tune the unichip.
Maybe working with Red, Ballrub, and Tony from the racers group, we could actually make it happen.
I've been DYING to try to get this thing tuned right....*hops from foot to foot with anticipation*
09-24-2002, 08:19 AM
#48
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QUOTE
JAWS 021:
They are the makers of the unichip
*waits again for a response*
Ummm yeah that was helpful....They are the makers of the unichip
*waits again for a response*
How about this:
Link to actual web site
09-24-2002, 09:28 AM
#50
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Racers Group is the N. American distributor for Dastek (Unichip--which is also a S. African based company).
We have the software and programer for the Unichip, and just received our port replicator for our laptop so we can use it now, and will be doing so on your cars Tony (wanna see that "foot-to-foot hop" again!!!!)
Up for a "road trip" to L.A. Red? You could be very instrumental on helping us out?!
We have the software and programer for the Unichip, and just received our port replicator for our laptop so we can use it now, and will be doing so on your cars Tony (wanna see that "foot-to-foot hop" again!!!!)
Up for a "road trip" to L.A. Red? You could be very instrumental on helping us out?!