Whoa whoa....keep cool, Red. I'm not trying to start anything; there's no need to get cocky.



I didn't miss anything. I just got a little concerned when the first posts to the topic were regarding fitment into a 2K3 Tib bay and twin turbo apps. Hence the sad.gif and not the or rolleyes.gif.But it doesn't matter...

I know next-to-nothing about these engines, which is part of what makes me so curious about them. I figured that the Santa Fe variant of the Delta would be more of an SUV high-torque thing, moreso than the touring-coupe Tiburon variant...kinda like the different variants of the Beta for the Elantra and Tiburon. What is it that makes the difference? Are there different cam sets, like with the Elantra / Tiburon Betas? Or does the difference lie solely in the transmissions? 4DoorGL, you say you're gonna supercharge...is there a company out that's making supers for the engine already, or is it going to be a HyundaiPerformance.com unit? Red and others, do you think the Delta will handle the lower boost of a supercharger with stock internals better than it would a turbo app, or is this engine basically best left N/A?

I do appreciate all the help you guys are giving on this...but I'm just trying to get good answers for a low-level upgrade to this engine. This friend isn't looking (or really wanting) a power demon out of this engine...he may even find enough of a gain out of simple N/A tweaks, like a CAI, cone filter, and headers. We'll see...it's not a near-time project. But the sooner I can gather information for him, the better decisions he's gonna make. smile.gif

 

To put it simply, and to restate what red has already stated... The V6 delta motors are weak. Weak Rods, weak cranks, weak blocks. 250 HP may do okay for a few thousand miles...but it will never do 100,000.

The reason the Korean tuners use the 2.0L beta to crank out 600 HP? Because it can handle it. The reason there is next to no mods for the 2.5L or 2.7L Delta? It can't handle it.

My guess is the same as Red. Some N/A mods would help, but don't expect more than 225 to the wheels.
Extrude Hone the Intake Manifold, BTB, CAI, Headers...etc.. But don't be supprised if the engine goes south after 50,000 miles.

You might want to contact Cheuk to get his take on it, but in all the Korean mags I've seen, and all the korean website surfing I've done...the Delta series is NOT the motor to be messin' with.

 

Although there really isn't much way around the weak block, are there replacement forged rods and pistons for the Delta? I assume that the tuners tinkering with this engine in Korea are replacing those to get a little more life out of their engines...

 

Do the Santa Fes only come in v6 I thought you could get them a 4cyl.? Maybe I wrong though.

 

The crank is also weak. Hard to get around that one too! eek.gif

 

But keep in mind the Korean tuners have always had the 2.5L SOHC Delta in the Sonata, nobody has really tested the 2.7L DOHC Delta yet. Besides, Hyundai is using a new method to manufacture the crank which should make it a lot stronger. Here's the details:

 

When's that non-twist supposed to go into production?

And, although it'd be a real hassle, would cryo-treating the crank help?

 

First off a twist forging is forged the same way a four cylinder is made, with the throws 180 degrees apart. After a V engines crank is forged while it is still hot, they press the throw to the desired angle. A not twist forging die is very expensive to produce, due to the complexity of the die it self. The not twist is forged, with all the crank throws already close to the desired angle. By either heating a component then letting it slowy cool at a controled rate or chilling a component to crygenic tempratures, you can help reduce residual stresses found in the component. That won't help with the grain structure of the crank that has been disrupted twisting the throws. Sometimes it helps increase the strength by either needle peening or shot peening the crank fillets. The peening of the fillets adds whats called compresive stresses. When you have compressive stresses, in order for component to fail it must first go through the compressive before entering the point negative stress.
When a crank fails in a journal, the cracks are always a 45 degree angle, because of the torsional load being applied. To sum it up, no the after treatment of the crank won't change the grain structure, but will help relieve the resisdual stresses. Its hard for me to recommend doing it on seasoned components, simply out of the fact that the seasons components have already been relieved through 1000's of heating and cooling cycles. The same could also be said for new components, by doing the stress relieveing a component may get weaker if any compressive stress was set from the manufacturing process.

[ January 11, 2002: Message edited by: HRD_Tiburon ]

[ January 11, 2002: Message edited by: HRD_Tiburon ]

 

hey guys, RED/CHEUK??? I'm wondering if the problems that the guys in KOREA are having so many problems with this engine it's the same reason that HYUNDAI has been staying quiet about... I read it in one of the HP.COM posts that the v6 engines were completely collapsing on customers on the road and everywhere, pistons flying and seals breaking, and that's w/o turbocharging... Could it just be that the ones that were being worked on in KOREA were some of those that were DEFECTS from the factory cause they were built from (damn forgot the dates but in 2001)???

what's the most recent dated motor Cheuk that you've seen being worked on???

 

The new manufacturing process listed above has nothing to do with strength; it has to do with manufacturing costs. This new processes is supposed to yield more accurate results versus the old method. This new process is also supposed to allow a lighter crankshaft to take the place of the usual heavier metals.

The new process is a time and cost savings feature, it is not a "strength" feature. The DELTA series engines are well "thought out" unlike the sloppy BETA engines, but at the same time they are still much weaker. That note comes from Cheuk...

As for cryotreating: Proper cryogenic application makes the atomic structure of the part align itself into proper lattices. This proper alignment is supposed to yield better overall strength versus tensile, torsional and compressive loads. Unfortunately, there is no "general rule" as to how much help you get.

The crank failures mentioned are cracks where the rod journal meets the counterweight arm. These may be caused by vibration, brittle joints or just too much torsional load on that particular joint.

-Red-