majik

I wish I was in that military court coming to a verdict. It'd be simple for me.

majik

yeovilsteve:
I welcome your alternate views on the subject. I want to set you straight on something though. The comment was made that the media is anti-american. I think what might have been meant was that the media is heavily anti-Bush, especially here in America. The stories of booby-trapping bodies and those already posted are true. In the same situation, I may have done the same thing. I also don't agree with the comments "smoke the mother ---- !" but I can see where the soldier in this situation could have been just in doing what he did. They ARE fighting in house-to-house combat and they've seen their fellow soldiers killed by people faking surrender or even by children strapped with bombs approaching them and being suicide bombers themselves.

It's horrible what's going on over there, but I do think it's a worthwhile cause.

And yes, WMD's have been found. Please do more research on it, they have definitely found WMD's and there is proof that they were transported weeks before we invaded. Hell, we gave them enough time by going to the U.N. and asking... which was useless if you understand the corrupted U.N.

I also pose this question to you: "Torture" of the prisoners at the Abu Gharib prison was of course unethical and immoral in my opinion. It shouldn't have been done. But can you AT ALL compare that to the torture that they have put American prisoners through? Beheadings? Separating of limbs?

REDZMAN

Ignorance is butting it's head in here again.

Ficticious WMD?

Unkay.

Guess you are one of them guys that didn't know there have been 2 Nerve Gas attacks in Iraq since the war started. Or about the stockpiles of Sarin and Mustard gas shells we've found.

Of course not.

01tibby

guys, please keep it civil.

silvertibbs

Yeah man, yeoevil asked not to take offence, so did I. Just a matter of opinion.

I never heard of the Nerve Gas attacks, I know they had biochem suits they had to put on a couple times, but that was it. CRAZY BASTARDS.

REDZMAN

Yup. 2 attacks, and numerous stockpiles.

The fact is, you don't NEED stockpiles of these weapons when you can convert a LEGAL factory making baby milk, powdered, into making 2 METRIC TONS of Anthrax Spores an hour, in 8 hours.


I've been trained in NBC Defence and know a LOT of this stuff. The news just doesn't hop all over it because they aren't HUGE STOCKPILES< and no troops were seriously injured in the attacks.

tibu971.8L

Semper Fidelis: Always faithful




May this war end soon and our soldiers come back home safe and sound...

The soldier in question should definately get a Court Martial and if found guilty, be processed to the full extent of Military Law. Just because this is an Urban War, doesn't mean America's military can be allowed to do whatever they want, be it or not that the enemy fights in an unconventional manner and does not follow the Geneva Convention Laws of Military Warfare.

I do feel very sorry for him because my father used to/tells me stories similar to those when he was in the Marines in Vietnam. And any way the situation is looked upon it's just plainly FUBAR. However all the men and women of the military chose to be in the military and therefore must accept the consequences.

techcontib

I take everything with a grain of salt and nothing literally. I see other peoples point of view and see how peoples minds have been made up of what the MEDIA SHOWED them. There are alot of GOOD things that are going on in Iraq which of course never makes the MEDIA because its not what pays the bills. You will never here about it either.


<rant>P.S. To everyone MARINES are not soldiers, the Army has soldiers<unrant>

BIGTRE13

Technically I said "wasted" 8) , but anyway. This comment came from someone who has been in those type of situations before. When you go into a house to house combat situation your whole mindset changes and it has to in order to survive. I have seen my Brothers blown-up, limbs cut off by "wounded and unarmed" combatants. So please understand that when I made MY comment it was not fueled by the media or any propaganda but by real life experience. I wish no one ever had to make that type of decision, but in the climate that they are in it is unfortunately a reality. In War everyone does not play by the rules, that does not mean we can just break them, but please remember there is not much time to think when you are put into certain cituations...
THE THINGS WE REMEMBER,JUST MAY BE WHAT KEEPS US ALIVE.

peace, love and understanding ............................ 8)

yeovilsteve

thanks for your considered views, i expected much more abuse. i was also expecting a "TRUTH?, YOU CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH!" jack nicholson tirade, glad i escaped that aswell.

on the subject of combat stress, yes its an impossible situation to try and make life and death calls in such situations. would i have shot the guy? honestly, i dont know. thats why soldiers are trained so well.to deal with all these situations in a reasoned and proffesional way. my comments were not an attempt to demonise that particular soldier, but to show that there are ramifications to the choices you make.hindsight is a wonderful thing but the fact remains, the guy executed an unarmed wounded man in front of a camera crew. and this was what was broadcast to the world. and so he (and the american military) have to deal with the consequences of that. again its a shitty deal but thats the deal.

redz if i am ignorant then so be it (although i think thats a little harsh.) but on the subject of wmd's i have seen no evidence of stockpiles of biological agents,sarin, other nerve gas, anthrax, saddams extensive and very near to completion nuclear program, the 45 minute claim (are you guys familiar with this?). if evidence exists then i am yet to see it. if it is brought to my attention then yes i will concede that the "fictisious wmd" claim was wrong and i will change it to "less than 1% of the wmd were found than were claimed prior to the war" i saw the broadcast of colin powell in front of the un commitee claiming thousands of tons of chemical agents, advanced nuclear program, biological labs producing tons of agents, etc etc. this would appear to be what prompted him to resign. when you are fed false information by your intelligence community and you are the one they pick to be the public face of it that must really stick in your throat. he was lied to and was asked to lie to the world, which loyally he did. his resignation was a great shame, you guys lost a great statesman there.

whether your domestic media is anti bush i cant say. all i can tell you is mr bush is seen as a figure of ridicule throughout most of the world. you may not care, nor should you!. after all f**k what everyone else thinks. you elected him, thats democracy. the media reflects what the people want to hear (thats how you sell papers and telly) unfortunately most of the world is anti bush. whether you care about that or not im afraid that is a fact.

apologies for the misquote of bigtre13 but im sure you got what i was meaning.

in response to majiktib i was in no way comparing what went on in abu gharib to the disgusting scenes we saw around the world of the execution of american prisoners. my point was its a slippery slope, torture of any prisoner should not be tolerated otherwise where does it end. at the moment you have right and justice on your side, dont give people a chance to say "yeah the americans preach adherence to law but flout it themselves" when situations like the cia handing prisoners over to the saudis to interogate, knowing full well what interogation techniques will be used. (as happened recently) become common knowledge a little tarnish appears on americas name around the world. after all torture by proxy is still torture.

again no offence is meant, you guys have freedom of speech that is a great thing which must be protected. i wish all the coalition troops a safe and speedy return.

man this is getting heavy, lets talk about my new catback exhaust................