Sparks flying everywhere!
07-27-2009, 05:50 PM
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Sparks flying everywhere!
Ok, so this is kind of a weird one. I'm experiencing this really ODD spark leaping from the crank pully to the firewall. When I say "spark," I'm not talking some wimpy lil' just-rubbed-a-cats-fur-backwards thing. We're talking a mammoth explosion of electrical firestorm that snap almost 4" (yeah i measured), brilliant blue-white.
BangHead.gif
Now here's the embarrasing kicker: I'M ACTUALLY ASE CERTIFIED. In electrical, no less. (amongst other things). But i've checked every :censored: plug, wire, sensor, component, and random bug's arse that happened to get caught in my grill. everythings in specs. i mean, EVERYTHING. My car just got totalled two weeks ago (i'm rebuilding it), chopped thru the wiring harness, so i figured rewiring, rerouting, and mounting the battery in the trunk might fix it, right? WRONG!!! Yeah. I'll admit, I'm stumped. Even the local Hyundai dealership (which I have a REALLY low opinion of their service department anyway, but I'm starting to get worried here) couldn't think of anything. There's nothing physically WRONG with the car (other than sounding like an electric fence that increases with RPMs), I cant find any excess voltage leaking into or out of any of the systems, it even purrs like a kitten! Well... a kitten with a shock collar on it anyway.
Has anyone EVER heard of this?!? Best advice the dealership could offer is "replace the alternator for $215 in parts," but the alternator tests out fine.
BangHead.gif
I will bowdown.gif to whomever can shed light upon this subject, and say unto them: yesmaster.gif
BangHead.gif
Now here's the embarrasing kicker: I'M ACTUALLY ASE CERTIFIED. In electrical, no less. (amongst other things). But i've checked every :censored: plug, wire, sensor, component, and random bug's arse that happened to get caught in my grill. everythings in specs. i mean, EVERYTHING. My car just got totalled two weeks ago (i'm rebuilding it), chopped thru the wiring harness, so i figured rewiring, rerouting, and mounting the battery in the trunk might fix it, right? WRONG!!! Yeah. I'll admit, I'm stumped. Even the local Hyundai dealership (which I have a REALLY low opinion of their service department anyway, but I'm starting to get worried here) couldn't think of anything. There's nothing physically WRONG with the car (other than sounding like an electric fence that increases with RPMs), I cant find any excess voltage leaking into or out of any of the systems, it even purrs like a kitten! Well... a kitten with a shock collar on it anyway.
Has anyone EVER heard of this?!? Best advice the dealership could offer is "replace the alternator for $215 in parts," but the alternator tests out fine.
BangHead.gif
I will bowdown.gif to whomever can shed light upon this subject, and say unto them: yesmaster.gif
07-27-2009, 06:46 PM
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sounds like your grounds are messed up. check your engine ground and chassis ground. thats usually where that sparking come from. we get that alot at work nowadays
07-28-2009, 01:46 AM
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Yeah, your engine to chassis ground is inadequate...probably nonexistent. If that doesn't clear it up (but it will) check out the coil packs.
07-28-2009, 07:34 AM
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I've got nearly the exact same problem but mine leaps from the crank over to the oil pan lip, so less than an inch. Here's what I've checked to no avail
New NGK plug wires
New grounds with high quality 4ga and 8ga wire (also retained and cleaned up stockers)
-I also used a test light to ensure all grounds are good. Every piece of metal under the hood has a solid ground now. I've got a new ground from valve cover bolt to core support and also a beefier one on the back of the motor off the head. I checked and verified the oil pan and its bolts are grounds.
Always had nice 4ga charge and ground from alternator to battery as well as stocks, but took them off
Took belt off alternator and cables off as well to completely eliminate it
Disconnected my amps/capacitor for my stereo
Unhooked leads from coils and cranked - the pulley develops its charge from rotation, not the ignition system (as far as I can tell)
I know for sure the spark originates in the pulley because I can take a screw driver or anything metal and hold it near the pulley as the car is running and the spark will jump to the screw driver. As the OP said, its bright white/blue and LOUD. Mine also changes with revving, with more frequent sparks as it runs faster. I have never heard of anything like this in my life, and its been going on for a bout 2 months or maybe a bit longer with no changes at all that I've noticed - although this past week or two it almost seems to be happening more often.
Additionally, the first time I noticed this was having my local mechanic I have everything I don't have time to do myself do my timing belt, so my only guess is perhaps there is something in the bottom half of the timing cover that I cannot see or get to without taking the pulley off. What a headache!
Oh and btw, the only 2 non-standard things I haven't disabled are my Viper alarm/starter and my Sunpro tach. Every aftermarket thing had been done and on the car for some time without any issues before getting the timing belt done as preventative maintenance. As with the OP, the car runs absolutely fine, idles perfect and still gets 32MPG even with me driving like an ass.
New NGK plug wires
New grounds with high quality 4ga and 8ga wire (also retained and cleaned up stockers)
-I also used a test light to ensure all grounds are good. Every piece of metal under the hood has a solid ground now. I've got a new ground from valve cover bolt to core support and also a beefier one on the back of the motor off the head. I checked and verified the oil pan and its bolts are grounds.
Always had nice 4ga charge and ground from alternator to battery as well as stocks, but took them off
Took belt off alternator and cables off as well to completely eliminate it
Disconnected my amps/capacitor for my stereo
Unhooked leads from coils and cranked - the pulley develops its charge from rotation, not the ignition system (as far as I can tell)
I know for sure the spark originates in the pulley because I can take a screw driver or anything metal and hold it near the pulley as the car is running and the spark will jump to the screw driver. As the OP said, its bright white/blue and LOUD. Mine also changes with revving, with more frequent sparks as it runs faster. I have never heard of anything like this in my life, and its been going on for a bout 2 months or maybe a bit longer with no changes at all that I've noticed - although this past week or two it almost seems to be happening more often.
Additionally, the first time I noticed this was having my local mechanic I have everything I don't have time to do myself do my timing belt, so my only guess is perhaps there is something in the bottom half of the timing cover that I cannot see or get to without taking the pulley off. What a headache!
Oh and btw, the only 2 non-standard things I haven't disabled are my Viper alarm/starter and my Sunpro tach. Every aftermarket thing had been done and on the car for some time without any issues before getting the timing belt done as preventative maintenance. As with the OP, the car runs absolutely fine, idles perfect and still gets 32MPG even with me driving like an ass.
07-28-2009, 10:47 AM
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Did you unplug the coil pack plugs or the plug wires? If you just unplugged the wires I know this sounds sort of weird, but I would change your plugs and wires. If the resistance on the wires gets excessive the spark energy can leap from the coil pack to the head, or if there's a spot with poor insulation from the plug wire to the head.
As far as why the spark would leap from the pulley to the oil pan I'm not sure, I'm guessing it's the path of least resistance from the point it originates.
The only other time I've had "loose" high voltage in the engine bay was a cracked coil pack.
As far as why the spark would leap from the pulley to the oil pan I'm not sure, I'm guessing it's the path of least resistance from the point it originates.
The only other time I've had "loose" high voltage in the engine bay was a cracked coil pack.
07-28-2009, 01:37 PM
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Yeah i'm in the same boat as joker. new grounds, NOTHING aftermarket attached, full fresh tune up...WAIT. DUDE. started happening after i replaced my timing belt too!
hmmm.... that's interesting. the only thing that seems to have any effect on it is the status of my oil. Oddly enough, the closer i get to needing an oil change, the more often and regular the spark. weird... Well, I cant say that i'm too awfully worried (upcoming beta swap 'n all), but i'm glad that i'm not the only one that has experienced this freakish occurence.
oh, joker: checked all around my timing belt, nothing appears to be rubbing. did your mechanic replace the tensioner as well? I replaced mine, i'm starting to wonder if the tensioner itself could be building up a static charge as it spins; i know that an electric charge is possible to be transferred via either the bolts to the block or the timing belt itself (see a cut out of a Van de Graaf generator, the plasma ball touchy things at spencers: they use a rubber belt to carry a charge to the pole in the globe).
oh, and fresh new coils. even checked, no voltage leaking from them and all sparks strong.
hmmm.... that's interesting. the only thing that seems to have any effect on it is the status of my oil. Oddly enough, the closer i get to needing an oil change, the more often and regular the spark. weird... Well, I cant say that i'm too awfully worried (upcoming beta swap 'n all), but i'm glad that i'm not the only one that has experienced this freakish occurence.
oh, joker: checked all around my timing belt, nothing appears to be rubbing. did your mechanic replace the tensioner as well? I replaced mine, i'm starting to wonder if the tensioner itself could be building up a static charge as it spins; i know that an electric charge is possible to be transferred via either the bolts to the block or the timing belt itself (see a cut out of a Van de Graaf generator, the plasma ball touchy things at spencers: they use a rubber belt to carry a charge to the pole in the globe).
oh, and fresh new coils. even checked, no voltage leaking from them and all sparks strong.
07-28-2009, 04:24 PM
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grease them pulleys up guys. the friction from metal to metal contact on the pulley creates static. and at high revs that can build up real quick. explains it all.
07-28-2009, 06:05 PM
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if you're talking about the timing belt tensioner pulley, no grease point.
if you're talking about the crank pulley, never heard of any other car doing this.
o well: looks like we have the world's largest bug zapper!
if you're talking about the crank pulley, never heard of any other car doing this.
o well: looks like we have the world's largest bug zapper!