The Human Condition As Observed By Me
01-19-2012, 01:42 PM
#21
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ha that guy totally discredits the whole show cause he is like partially insane.
but that show trips me out sometimes......... I BELIEVE! lmao
haha, i just changed my FB religion to ancient aliens
but that show trips me out sometimes......... I BELIEVE! lmao
haha, i just changed my FB religion to ancient aliens
01-23-2012, 01:02 PM
#22
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I respect your opinion and beliefs, but it always grates on me when such things are spoken as facts. You can have all the lack of faith you want, you're still wrong. But stating lack of faith as the sensible position really is what grates people with different beliefs than you the wrong way. Especially when you have two people who through lack of faith believe in two sets of differing, sometimes conflicting, facts.
If you all (all people without faiths) would just chill out, there wouldn't be nearly as many conflicts. "I think..." should precede most of what you say about the way things are. Because like it or not, you don't know. You're just convinced of a certain set of "facts".
********
You see? It works both ways. I am offended at your taking offense, and will SUE! Chilling out is the major factor needed to get a little more peace 'round here. A little more tolerance of variance by the "tolerant" and a little more not blowing up the infidel by people whose made-up religions call for it.
Here's your favorite line of the thread: The difference is, my facts are true and everybody else believes a LIE!!!!!1!
If you all (all people without faiths) would just chill out, there wouldn't be nearly as many conflicts. "I think..." should precede most of what you say about the way things are. Because like it or not, you don't know. You're just convinced of a certain set of "facts".
********
You see? It works both ways. I am offended at your taking offense, and will SUE! Chilling out is the major factor needed to get a little more peace 'round here. A little more tolerance of variance by the "tolerant" and a little more not blowing up the infidel by people whose made-up religions call for it.
Here's your favorite line of the thread: The difference is, my facts are true and everybody else believes a LIE!!!!!1!
And I f*cking hate listening to egotistical people, regardless of their "reasons" for being a-holes.
01-23-2012, 11:40 PM
#23
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To be quite clear: when I know I'm right my ego won't fit through the door. I can be convinced I'm wrong but it's got to be bulletproof if I've already done my homework and convinced myself.
Also: being intractably confident about being correct is not a problem IMO. Claim to have or lack all the answers you like, and keep to yourself what you like. It's a free Internet (until SOPA II passes). Just don't expect the strong-willed/pig-headed/stubborn/egotistical/whatever you like to call it people to sit down and be quiet because it suits you
Also: being intractably confident about being correct is not a problem IMO. Claim to have or lack all the answers you like, and keep to yourself what you like. It's a free Internet (until SOPA II passes). Just don't expect the strong-willed/pig-headed/stubborn/egotistical/whatever you like to call it people to sit down and be quiet because it suits you
01-24-2012, 06:22 AM
#24
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They both come down to circular logic. Christianity believes on the Bible, and the Bible says it's true. It makes sense because it says so (and there are no other plausible explanations as to why the universe exists).
Those who believe logic belive it because it makes logical sense. Logic says that logic makes sense. The Bible says the Bible is true. Both sides end up with circular reasoning. I find that the Bible is a LOT more plausible than the theories they keep trying to force in schools, and present as "fact".
Those who believe logic belive it because it makes logical sense. Logic says that logic makes sense. The Bible says the Bible is true. Both sides end up with circular reasoning. I find that the Bible is a LOT more plausible than the theories they keep trying to force in schools, and present as "fact".
01-24-2012, 10:33 AM
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I do not offer a replacement set of facts, but I also don't support choosing an illogical set of facts simply because some people say it is so and/or nobody has presented a quantifiably better answer.
That goes for the Bible, Koran, 11th grade astronomy textbook, Teh Internets, Wikipedia, a Brief History of Time, etc.
Not knowing the answer is a fine option which too few people can accept. I find many of the same flaws in mainstream science as I do in religion. In fact in many ways they're not all that different. It is very difficult to reverse accepted theories in mainstream science, but there is a method for it and that which can be proven will become accepted. Much of what science believes to be true today will be further refined or found to be incorrect. However it is the ability to logically go through and correct inaccuracies discovered through continued research that makes science great. To do so to a religious text...even if necessary to correct obvious, easily proven inaccuracies...won't happen.
As far as egotistical a-holes go, they aren't going away. Congratulations on being a big part of the problem, and fueling the reasons why your own kind are hated by many of the people with differing views around the world. It's the way you behave that piss people off and make them want to do things like have the ten commandments removed from courthouses and schools. Atheists don't generally care about such things, they've just been treated so badly by the a**holes that are so sure of their answers that they'll strike out in any way possible. And when they do? The true face of the masses of Christianity present themselves, like in the recent case of the death threats received by the girl having the mural removed at her school.
Like it or not, accept it or not, as a mass Christians ARE a**hole bullies. On an individual basis, most are fine. Most of my friends are Christian.
I've got no problem with Jesus, it's his (vocal) followers I can't stand. Even if the Bible was proven somehow to be 100% accurate and genuine I would not join a church. I don't support terrorist organizations. No matter how long they've been in business or how popular they are.
That goes for the Bible, Koran, 11th grade astronomy textbook, Teh Internets, Wikipedia, a Brief History of Time, etc.
Not knowing the answer is a fine option which too few people can accept. I find many of the same flaws in mainstream science as I do in religion. In fact in many ways they're not all that different. It is very difficult to reverse accepted theories in mainstream science, but there is a method for it and that which can be proven will become accepted. Much of what science believes to be true today will be further refined or found to be incorrect. However it is the ability to logically go through and correct inaccuracies discovered through continued research that makes science great. To do so to a religious text...even if necessary to correct obvious, easily proven inaccuracies...won't happen.
As far as egotistical a-holes go, they aren't going away. Congratulations on being a big part of the problem, and fueling the reasons why your own kind are hated by many of the people with differing views around the world. It's the way you behave that piss people off and make them want to do things like have the ten commandments removed from courthouses and schools. Atheists don't generally care about such things, they've just been treated so badly by the a**holes that are so sure of their answers that they'll strike out in any way possible. And when they do? The true face of the masses of Christianity present themselves, like in the recent case of the death threats received by the girl having the mural removed at her school.
Like it or not, accept it or not, as a mass Christians ARE a**hole bullies. On an individual basis, most are fine. Most of my friends are Christian.
I've got no problem with Jesus, it's his (vocal) followers I can't stand. Even if the Bible was proven somehow to be 100% accurate and genuine I would not join a church. I don't support terrorist organizations. No matter how long they've been in business or how popular they are.
01-24-2012, 12:42 PM
#26
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I do not offer a replacement set of facts, but I also don't support choosing an illogical set of facts simply because some people say it is so and/or nobody has presented a quantifiably better answer.
That goes for the Bible, Koran, 11th grade astronomy textbook, Teh Internets, Wikipedia, a Brief History of Time, etc.
Not knowing the answer is a fine option which too few people can accept. I find many of the same flaws in mainstream science as I do in religion. In fact in many ways they're not all that different. It is very difficult to reverse accepted theories in mainstream science, but there is a method for it and that which can be proven will become accepted. Much of what science believes to be true today will be further refined or found to be incorrect. However it is the ability to logically go through and correct inaccuracies discovered through continued research that makes science great. To do so to a religious text...even if necessary to correct obvious, easily proven inaccuracies...won't happen.
As far as egotistical a-holes go, they aren't going away. Congratulations on being a big part of the problem, and fueling the reasons why your own kind are hated by many of the people with differing views around the world. It's the way you behave that piss people off and make them want to do things like have the ten commandments removed from courthouses and schools. Atheists don't generally care about such things, they've just been treated so badly by the a**holes that are so sure of their answers that they'll strike out in any way possible. And when they do? The true face of the masses of Christianity present themselves, like in the recent case of the death threats received by the girl having the mural removed at her school.
Like it or not, accept it or not, as a mass Christians ARE a**hole bullies. On an individual basis, most are fine. Most of my friends are Christian.
I've got no problem with Jesus, it's his (vocal) followers I can't stand. Even if the Bible was proven somehow to be 100% accurate and genuine I would not join a church. I don't support terrorist organizations. No matter how long they've been in business or how popular they are.
That goes for the Bible, Koran, 11th grade astronomy textbook, Teh Internets, Wikipedia, a Brief History of Time, etc.
Not knowing the answer is a fine option which too few people can accept. I find many of the same flaws in mainstream science as I do in religion. In fact in many ways they're not all that different. It is very difficult to reverse accepted theories in mainstream science, but there is a method for it and that which can be proven will become accepted. Much of what science believes to be true today will be further refined or found to be incorrect. However it is the ability to logically go through and correct inaccuracies discovered through continued research that makes science great. To do so to a religious text...even if necessary to correct obvious, easily proven inaccuracies...won't happen.
As far as egotistical a-holes go, they aren't going away. Congratulations on being a big part of the problem, and fueling the reasons why your own kind are hated by many of the people with differing views around the world. It's the way you behave that piss people off and make them want to do things like have the ten commandments removed from courthouses and schools. Atheists don't generally care about such things, they've just been treated so badly by the a**holes that are so sure of their answers that they'll strike out in any way possible. And when they do? The true face of the masses of Christianity present themselves, like in the recent case of the death threats received by the girl having the mural removed at her school.
Like it or not, accept it or not, as a mass Christians ARE a**hole bullies. On an individual basis, most are fine. Most of my friends are Christian.
I've got no problem with Jesus, it's his (vocal) followers I can't stand. Even if the Bible was proven somehow to be 100% accurate and genuine I would not join a church. I don't support terrorist organizations. No matter how long they've been in business or how popular they are.
Wow, that is a powerful statement my friend, and I agree 100%.
01-25-2012, 01:02 AM
#27
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+rep for that floyd.
Agnosticism is pretty much applied pragmatism, it seems. In any debate, especially this one, you have to be at least a little bit agnostic as both sides of the argument have lots of valid points. I'm not involved in astronomy, particle physics, or ancient history, so I can't really take a hardline stance on either side of the argument. I just make the best guess I can given the material that has been presented to me.
Most religions have a pretty shocking track record though, the spirituality is swept aside and the institution abuses the considerable power it has attained.
Agnosticism is pretty much applied pragmatism, it seems. In any debate, especially this one, you have to be at least a little bit agnostic as both sides of the argument have lots of valid points. I'm not involved in astronomy, particle physics, or ancient history, so I can't really take a hardline stance on either side of the argument. I just make the best guess I can given the material that has been presented to me.
Most religions have a pretty shocking track record though, the spirituality is swept aside and the institution abuses the considerable power it has attained.
01-25-2012, 10:11 PM
#28
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Wow hey I think you might have even got yourself with a brush that broad LOL
Show me a book that old, written by that many authors, that coherent throughout, with as much archaeological evidence supporting it. Every part that could be proved is proved or is an open question - almost like science, but without all the pesky paradigm shifting with each new discovery. It just keeps getting more support from science and history, not that it makes a difference to how true the book is, just how hard it is to refute.
Show me a book that old, written by that many authors, that coherent throughout, with as much archaeological evidence supporting it. Every part that could be proved is proved or is an open question - almost like science, but without all the pesky paradigm shifting with each new discovery. It just keeps getting more support from science and history, not that it makes a difference to how true the book is, just how hard it is to refute.
01-26-2012, 12:02 AM
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The sun rotates around the Earth
The Earth has edges
The Earth has a solid foundation
Bats are birds
Hares chew their cud
There are of course many more, but there is no way to look at a book as being scientifically valid which makes such wildly fundamentally inaccurate claims, and follows them with highly implausible statistics regarding the age of the Earth, and the order of creation. It is laughable to say "Sure, the book is wrong about the Earth being the center of everything. But everything else...the stuff that you would have had to be there to witness to prove or disprove...is totally valid 100% truth."
01-26-2012, 09:19 PM
#30
Super Moderator
Aaaaand that's the departure point I was waiting for, knowing it would come. I think it's fair to say we are arguing from differing first principals by now. 
