01tibby

advanced warning, this is going to be long.

ok, this is still a bit down the road. i still have to finish my bbk, and also get my carputer in. after that im going to start buying stuff for the turbo kit. i'd like to get the turbo soon though to help out adeihl, and to get it cheaper than i can get it anywhere else. wink1.gif

as far as my capabilities, i can get my uncle to weld up things like a dump pipe or something like that, but making a manifold from scrath aint gonna happen.

what i want from this system(in order of importance):

- reliable
- emissions friendly
- extremely responsive for autocrossing. it wont see any big open tracks.
- max whp around 250
- quarter times in the low 13s
- engine bay pretty-ness(rust is unnacceptable) wink1.gif

pretty much identical to gary's setup back in the day, but i want it to be really responsive:
http://www.rdtiburon.com/index.php?showtopic=11196

what is NOT going to happen:
-standalone
-internal engine work

TURBO

i already know its definately going to be a BB gt turbo. ive plotted on a total of 12 compressor maps and have narrowed it down. anything over 1000 is too expensive, anything less than %70 efficiency at max rpm is not enough. ive narrowed it down to the 6 following turbos. cheaper is better, but i dont want to skimp out to save a hundred bucks.

1. GT2560R - 466541 -1 MAP

2. GT2560R - 466541- 4
MAP

3. GT2860R - 707160 - 5
MAP

4. GT2871R - 472560 - 15
MAP

5. GT2871R - 743347- 1
MAP

6. GT2871R - 743347- 2
MAP


CHARACTERISTICS OF EACH (price from adeihl / efficiency@max rpm / turbo speed divided by one thousand@max rpm)

1. 825 / 72 / 126
2. 688 / 72 / 126
3. 705 / 75 / 122
4. 732 / 76 / 98
5. 960 / 74 / 100
6. 960 / 75 / 98

my number one choice right now is turbo #4. its cheap and still has a little bit more of its 76% effiency after my engine maxes out. my only concern is that i think it might be too big and not responsive enough. my knowledge of turbo sizes related to how much lag they will create is iffy at best. i also like #3. reaches 77% efficiency for a good chunk of the upper rpms. its spinning fast though, will that affect turbo longevity at all? destroy oil quicker? its still only at about half of measured turbo rpms on the map, and plus its water cooled too, so i dont think there will be problems.


MANIFOLD

i dont want to EVER have to replace alternators due to heat. especially since i might be upgrading my alternator down the road. my manifold options are:

1. OBX ebay manifold
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OBX-Racing-...sspagenameZWDVW

2. kspec manifolds
-TYPE 1
http://kspec.com/list.php?ac_id=85&ai_id=987
-TYPE 2
http://kspec.com/list.php?ac_id=85&ai_id=988

3. SR manifold
http://sharkracing.com/acecart/bin/shop.cg...&cate=010903000

4. something custom(viper/t4turbo/maybe even tim?)

i would REALLY like to go with the obx one because it is so cheap. i just dont know how close it will put the turbo to the alternator and fans. this is where the kspec type 2 and sr manifolds seem nice, i just dont know what other problems will be created by moving the turbo over that much. not to mention they are expensive as hell. atleast the sr one would come with a down-pipe.

i will have FAL fans btw, and might end up trying to get them to push through if they will fit. i also dont want to have to make a spacer block so that the turbo wont hit the block. it seems renante didnt have to with his gt28 turbo. getting the manifold jet-hotted is a possibility.


INTERCOOLER

im going to be buying 2.5" black intercooler piping from ebay and making my own. probably getting t-bolt clamps to replace the ones that come with it too. i just need to know dimensions on the intercooler i need.


FUEL MANAGEMENT

right now, im leaning towards a dual injector setup. going to try and get bungs welded in the im though instead of going the spacer route. no clue on how to fab up a fuel rail though. the smt-6 unit looks like the one to get, and we have a wealth of knowledge on here with jay and dennist. i know i will need a 255lph pump and additional injectors. what size injectors? im a little lost with fuel pressure regulating too. an fmu is all i need right?

i will have a carputer, so i can mess with stuff from there. i would like 8psi daily and about 15 for weekend track days. is that possible with the integral wastegate on the turbo? can you adjust boost via the smt or will i have to get an additional electronic boost controller?


OTHER STUFF

-Quaiffe will be used, although not right away probably

-what do i need to do as far as BOV is concerned? can i just get a cheap one and vent to atmo. or are the crappy ebay ones known to leak? can the smt compensate for venting to atmosphere. id assume because you have to add a MAP sensor for the smt right?

-im going to try out one of the cheaper clutch kits on ebay. the f1 one, unless anyone has had one already and its crap.

-i have a 61mm tb on now, but i might upgrade to the 65mm one on sharkracing. think i need it?

-airram would be nice, but im not shelling out 500+ for an intake manifold.

-i have a obd hookup for the carpc. what exactly can be monitored through obd? i want to monitor the following, but prefer not to have gauges all over my interior:

[*]a/f[*]egt[*]oil temp[*]oil press[*]boost[*]coolant temp[/list]-what spark plugs should i get?

-im going to get the eagle vaccum manifold.

-should i get a decomp. plate?



i think thats all. if you see a topic im missing, please bring attention to it. appreciate any help i can get. the only thing i ask that you do(apart from providing the massive amount of info i know you guys have) is not try to argue me out of the things i am set on. i.e. standalone and internal engine work.

thanks a bunch fellas.

faithofadragon

chris

after lookin over widebands i decided im gonna probably eventually get the ZIETRONIX unit

it has a built in port for a EGT, the wideband, boost guage all into one unit

so basically you can monitor all that from the same program...

here is a linky

you can find those on ebay for like 250 BUT the sensors for the egt and boost have to be purchased separately

hamhead

I would go with Turbo #3. As you said, it spinning so much does effect its longevity, but it being oil and water cooled should make it last a long time, and GT series turbos have nice longevity from what I've heard.

Do they not make alternator heat shields? I'm sure you could fab something up, even though it may not prettify the engine bay, a heat shield of some sort should keep it a bit cooler. Maybe a duct of some sort to get air to around it even, kind of like cooling brakes except with alternators. Tons of nifty little ideas that could counter the alternator problem.

Intercooler, any nice small sized one would work. For a visual reference, the ones from the EBay kit (Yamaha I believe is using one) are a good size for what power your seeking. Maybe even using a front mount off an EVO if there are a plethora of wrecked cars in your area.

Fuel management, I would get into contact with Dennisst and learn just what the SMT-6 can do. A manual boost controller is very helpful though, believe Greddy makes turbo timer/boost controllers built into one. Knock out two birds with one stone. Although if you can avoid buying it I would, I'm sure your out to save money at this point. Nothing wrong with sitting in the car for a twenty seconds to let the turbo settle down to save a hundred bucks or more off the bat at first.

I'm still unfamilar with the Tibs problem of venting to the atmosphere. I would just get a recirculated BOV at this point, if you want the sound, they make recirculating that make the sound as well. tongue.gif

Decomp plate make the car harder to tune for power. Renante's setup makes that very apparent.

Plugs, I would start with a step colder than stock and work from there. Check on them after a while and see if they're fouling/etc.

silvertibbs

Well, I'm glad to see you putting in some thought about getting the tibby some balls after you redo the entire thing. I love where your head's at. LOL

First off, I have a Type 1 manifold that has the flange separate. Could work out good for you as you can get your pal to make it work for you.

Anyway, as far as your turbos, I suggest #3. The GT2871R is a little larger, and would have slightly more lag, but more power. As you were looking for a quicker spool, that is my suggestion. But we'll let the heavy-weights make their assumptions.

Seems like you have everything else in order really. I know I'm preaching to the choir here but man, grab Maximum Boost by Corky Bell. Seriously. A guy like you would eat that book up. It would give you the exact formulas to decide on the size of your intercooler and all that fuel management stuff. I do have a copy though, if you want to pay for shipping to and from me, you're more than welcome to borrow if for as long as you need.

I'm just going to weigh in my $0.02 and anyone can correct me if needed.

Manifold - I have one that might work, but I suggest getting one from Viper's kit, he seems to know his stuff and he has killed alternators in the process, thus, you prolly won't if you get it from him/his guy.

Turbo - You've got that covered, I mentioned the one I like earlier

Downpipe - Again, check with Viper, whoever you get your manifold from should prolly do your DP as well.

Charge Pipes - YOu'll be fine with making them yourself just make sure you use 2.5" and no bigger.

Intercooler - If I recall correctly a 2" core is sufficient, you just have to decide of demensions. Too large and you'll lose a bit of power and too small and it's the same deal. This solely depends on what turbo and how much power you want.

BOV - A DSM one should work fine. Greddy is a good company too (PS I have both of these items FS wink1.gif ) BUt seriously for the amount of power you want and the cash you wanna spend I think it's a good choice. I believe the DSM ones are good for like 20psi or so.

Fuel Management - SMT6 seems to be the baby to get. It's a pretty powerful system if used right and I know you know what your doing with electronics so.......... I would suggest at least a Vortech FMU or even a full replacement FPR like a cartech or something like that. They look pretty and do a good job.

Injectors - Prolly gonna be tough as you're going with a dual fuel rail idea. For 250whp i dunno if you wanna deal with the dual setup, but hey, I'll let you figure that out. Random wasn't big on the idea from what I've read, it's too tough to select the right fuel ratios for the different injectors. I'd suggest upping the stockers to a little higher flowing and maxing them out.

Sparkplugs - One or two steps colder should work fine. NGK sells them over the web cheap.

I dunno hope that helps you out. Lemme know about the Corky Bell book though.

01tibby

yeah, i have maximum boost. its just with something like this you need to know things from people with experience with our cars.

the more i look at it, the more i like turbo #3 more as well. i think thats pretty much settled.

ive been talking with renante about the ssautochrome/obx manifold. he really liked it. said it worked and fit great. im starting to lena towards that and just getting my uncle to help me make a dump pipe.

if i can make the car run like stock at 250whp without the dual injector setup/ crappy safc not working correctly, then im all for it. i just dont think its possible.

2uniq

Tibby01
I sent you a PM
Have a OBX and Aplie Turbo piping and D/P for sale
Let me know

01tibby

Any of you guys dealt with the megasquirt system at all. im reading through and it looks VERY interesting. especially the II model.

Mad_john

injctors go with MSD-2014 4/1 peak hold drive they are great if you go over 1000cc inj you will have ideal issuse

get you cam 272 int/ext

if you can swap heads for an XD head solid tappets and get better valve springs ferria <i can spell worth a shit! ahhh lmao.gif this will stop any valve float that you will get

also if you can get your turbo external gated will help you alot in the HP depertment
and give you more option in the turbo department


wastegate and bov=tial

Hyundai4g63T

tibby,

I have a megasquirt sitting here that I was going to test in my car, but if you are willing to work with me on it I can help you out in getting it installed and running. And I will make you a killer deal on it.

For the turbo go with the GT2871R - 743347- 2 I have done serveral SR20 240's with these turbos and they are killer on a 2.0L motor. But I offer them in a T31 (Standard T3 2.5" 4 bolt Housing) housing which me and only a couple other Garrett Dealers have since we have the housing machined to accept the GT Turbos.

If you are intrested in a turbo manifold hit me up and we can work something out.

I missed the edit windo but here is a picture of a GT3071R with the T31 housing:

a_gut

Looks like most things have been covered - except, I haven't seen any mention of an exhaust setup. I assume you have one already?