max boost without aftermarket ems
06-09-2002, 06:40 PM
#1
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Maryland
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Vehicle: 2000 Tiburon
max boost without aftermarket ems
Quick question:
What is the Max boost a MAP based 97 tib can take without introducing an engine management system such as haltechs e6k ?
What is the Max boost a MAP based 97 tib can take without introducing an engine management system such as haltechs e6k ?
06-09-2002, 09:55 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 749
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm going to attempt 5 to 7 psi with just a rising rate fuel pressure regulator and upgraded fuel pump.
That's about the limit of what I want to do. It is possible; but you have to do it right:
fuel pump must be able to keep a proper A/F ratio under boost conditions.
fuel pressure regulator must be properly tuned.
you must have the right amount of intercooling.
Even with all this, 5 psi is all that is safe. Above that, you start maxing out the ignition timing limits. At around 7 psi, you max out the fuel system (even with an RRFPR and better pump).
I'm hoping to start installation in two months. I'll let you know how it goes.
As always: pick up a copy of Maximum Boost, by Corky Bell. a good turbocharger book.
ac
That's about the limit of what I want to do. It is possible; but you have to do it right:
fuel pump must be able to keep a proper A/F ratio under boost conditions.
fuel pressure regulator must be properly tuned.
you must have the right amount of intercooling.
Even with all this, 5 psi is all that is safe. Above that, you start maxing out the ignition timing limits. At around 7 psi, you max out the fuel system (even with an RRFPR and better pump).
I'm hoping to start installation in two months. I'll let you know how it goes.
As always: pick up a copy of Maximum Boost, by Corky Bell. a good turbocharger book.
ac
06-10-2002, 12:35 AM
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 1,436
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
1 Bar = 14.7psi
Boost isn't what you need to think about, total airflow is what you should be concerned with. Think about this: you are given two straws. The first straw is one of those tiny little red/pink coffee-stir straws, the second one is a frikken huge McDonalds straw.
If you pressurize both of these straws to 10psi, which one will flow more air? Ok, so why does 10psi on a boost gauge relate to much of anything when you're talking about horsepower?
It doesn't.
The dependancy here is the amount of air you're moving; pressure is definately required but isn't the correct measuring tool.
If you just want to strap on a turbo or supercharger without touching ANYTHING else, the most you can probably do is about 150WHP max. If you don't mind strapping on a bigger fuel pump, a set of bigger (440cc or 550cc) injectors and an S-AFC piggyback (that's about $700 in parts altogether) then you can probably run 220-230WHP on the stock computer max.
That's about it. Anything above that is going to require new internal engine parts (pistons anyway) and will require better computer equipment.
Boost isn't what you need to think about, total airflow is what you should be concerned with. Think about this: you are given two straws. The first straw is one of those tiny little red/pink coffee-stir straws, the second one is a frikken huge McDonalds straw.
If you pressurize both of these straws to 10psi, which one will flow more air? Ok, so why does 10psi on a boost gauge relate to much of anything when you're talking about horsepower?
It doesn't.
The dependancy here is the amount of air you're moving; pressure is definately required but isn't the correct measuring tool.
If you just want to strap on a turbo or supercharger without touching ANYTHING else, the most you can probably do is about 150WHP max. If you don't mind strapping on a bigger fuel pump, a set of bigger (440cc or 550cc) injectors and an S-AFC piggyback (that's about $700 in parts altogether) then you can probably run 220-230WHP on the stock computer max.
That's about it. Anything above that is going to require new internal engine parts (pistons anyway) and will require better computer equipment.
06-10-2002, 02:36 AM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 5,550
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
QUOTE
Red:
then you can probably run 220-230WHP on the stock computer max.
That's about it. Anything above that is going to require new internal engine parts (pistons anyway) and will require better computer equipment.
unless you use some giggle gas tongue.gif
then you can probably run 220-230WHP on the stock computer max.
That's about it. Anything above that is going to require new internal engine parts (pistons anyway) and will require better computer equipment.
06-10-2002, 02:42 AM
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 1,436
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I just realized you said MAP based '97 Tiburon. How exactly do you have a 1st Gen Tiburon running a MAP-based computer system? You must not be in North America...
If you truly are not in North America or Puerto Rico, then you likely do have a MAP sensor.
That being the case, there's not many people here who could tell you. The MAP-based Hyundai computers don't like S-AFC piggyback controllers, so you're out of luck with the bigger injector + SAFC fix.
And the very first moment that your computer sees more than about 1-2psi of positive pressure on the manifold, you're going to get a check-engine light.
If you're running MAP, you will HAVE to run all the fuel modifications mechanically instead of electronically. You can bump your injectors to something like 370cc, install an adjustable static fuel pressure regulator set at like 20psi (for idle), then install an adjustable rising-rate fuel pressure regulator for when you're on-bosot (something like a 3:1 or 4:1 setting). Then you'll need the requisite new fuel pump, some method of blocking your MAP sensor from "seeing" boost (but still reading vacuum) and a lot of tuning time on the dyno.
This is all likely more expensive and a little less accurate than the MAF-based options, but it would probably still allow your stock computer + engine to see the 200WHP mark.
If you truly are not in North America or Puerto Rico, then you likely do have a MAP sensor.
That being the case, there's not many people here who could tell you. The MAP-based Hyundai computers don't like S-AFC piggyback controllers, so you're out of luck with the bigger injector + SAFC fix.
And the very first moment that your computer sees more than about 1-2psi of positive pressure on the manifold, you're going to get a check-engine light.
If you're running MAP, you will HAVE to run all the fuel modifications mechanically instead of electronically. You can bump your injectors to something like 370cc, install an adjustable static fuel pressure regulator set at like 20psi (for idle), then install an adjustable rising-rate fuel pressure regulator for when you're on-bosot (something like a 3:1 or 4:1 setting). Then you'll need the requisite new fuel pump, some method of blocking your MAP sensor from "seeing" boost (but still reading vacuum) and a lot of tuning time on the dyno.
This is all likely more expensive and a little less accurate than the MAF-based options, but it would probably still allow your stock computer + engine to see the 200WHP mark.
06-10-2002, 04:51 AM
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 685
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
QUOTE
Curtas:
Even with all this, 5 psi is all that is safe. Above that, you start maxing out the ignition timing limits. At around 7 psi, you max out the fuel system (even with an RRFPR and better pump).
ac
I assume you are talking about ignightion Retard. Even with all this, 5 psi is all that is safe. Above that, you start maxing out the ignition timing limits. At around 7 psi, you max out the fuel system (even with an RRFPR and better pump).
ac
What if he found a way to avoid Det..
Would 7 be doable.
Or am I just reading this wrong.