AdamW

Hey. I have a question regarding the new COTM Rules about the various months for various "classes" of tib. Its kind of involved:
Aren't we already struggling, in recent months at least, to get people to enter COTM? If we further segment it as the new rules suggest, in certain months people will be unable to enter. Perhaps though, it is historically proven that the first few months of the year are slow. I'm not enterly sure, I didn't research, but it may be the truth.

I however do offer an alternate that may further spur the fun of voting in COTM. Instead of having a poll, why not have a rating system for different aspects of each car in the running. Then, we could total all points in each category, and whomever gets the most wins. For example, a five point rating system (0=worst, 5=best) for each general aspect:

Exterior Looks:
Interior Looks:
Performance:
etc.

I beleive these categories must be broad, and not too specific to detail every single thing. I would not want to rate things like motor bay apearance, cleanliness, etc.

There are many reasons why I bring this up after seeing the new rules. One is posted in my first paragraph, and the other is that what may be seen as asthetically pleasing to someone, may be interpreted completely different to someone else. Example: I vote go over show every COTM usually, because that's what I like. If I could instead break down general aspects of the entrants, I think we may get more people entering and also more discussion outside the voting area itself, promoting growth of RDT.

I started this forum to have a discussion with members and mods on this topic, so please ask me if you would like further explaination of certian areas. I know it may take some time to set something up like this, and to develop regulations on the administrative end, but I do believe something like this may further draw apeal to the RDT community.

majik

Exterior Looks: This will bring 8 Veilsides and 2 other body kits into the mix.
Interior: There aren't that many different interiors on this site. Some have more LEDs than others, but most have gauges, head unit, painted dash, and maybe custom seats.

Our purpose is to bring more users into the process. We don't want the same users winning every year. We want more involvement in the COTM process, whether the slightly modified or the heavily modified, everyone has a chance to win. People take pride in their cars when competing, so maybe this will encourage more involvement, more appreciation for their cars, and more interaction within the community. There are some cars on here I've only caught a glimpse of, but they see no reason to enter COTM because "majik wins every year" or they see no point in competing when they know they'll lose.

A 5-point rating system is currently not feasible. We need something automated, and the voting system offered by IPB is what we use. Calculating points for 100 members is just not really worth the effort. I don't think it would add much to the process. People DO vote for different reasons, based on their own ideas of the cars. Some vote for looks, some performance, some for the underdog who spends countless hours working on his own car to improve it. Whatever the reason, they're all valid and welcomed in the judging process. I think with the normal 90-110 voters we get, we'll get a good mixture of judging. The point system would further require users to POST their ratings, potentially altering the outcome of the COTM (I vote for 2nd place because I don't want 1st place to win, but I think 3rd place deserves my vote the most). I also don't want to be the one calculating points for 3 categories in each of 100 posts. It would cause a sharp decline in the voting involvement of the community.

You bring a valid argument, and I hope others will contribute similar arguments to possibly help improve the COTM process.

StrikeEagle

I think something like that would be sorta hard to set up, and then determining the final winner would be sorta tough.
In the past, I think entries have been slightly more scarce mainly because people (including me) know they can't win when it's wide open to everyone. Any time I think about running, someone like Majik or the UnholyTib or someone else with FI enters and sorta screws my chance of winning. The way it's set up now seems to encourage more people to enter, granted they'll probably only enter on their specific months, but at least there will be more of a chance of winning.
With the system you suggest, I think it would pretty much have the same result as before. You, for example, would rate a 5 on engine if they were FI, and probably rate the exterior a bit less. Either that, or you'd rate everything really high on your choice car so they get more points overall, rather than voting lower on components that are lacking. All said and done, I think the results wouldn't really change at all, and with the added confusion, I don't think it's really worth it.

The only change I would suggest is lengthening the time between winner's entries. Right now it's at a year, so if there's 12 really good cars, it seems like they would be the only winners, simply because they can enter every 12 months. I frequently find myself not voting for former winners simply for that fact (sorry DTN...). For now, I just want to see how this current scheme will turn out, hopefully it should encourage more people to enter, I know I will come November!!

AdamW

^^ SO your saying that if I liked 1 specific car, I would vote 5 on every aspect of the car? That's not what I am proposing, but I can definatly see that happening. If that did happen, it would go right back to basically the same voting system we have now.

I know I would still vote fairly, for each aspect, but I do see what you are pointing out here, in that it may almost be a loophole.

Hmmmm...

StrikeEagle

^^^ Exactly. You and I probably wouldn't do it, but there's lots of people who would. And there's no way to prevent it mechanically, so getting around it seems pretty tough.

Like you said, there's loopholes for everything, now just to find one with the least loopholes... lol

REDZMAN

Yeah, it took us a long time to come up with this way, and we are going to run it for some time. Everyone needs to feel they have a chance to win, so even a stock car, with almost no mods and really good pics should be able to win. This will also stop folks like DTN from entering in every frigging month till they win.

If we don't get enough entries in a class, we'll expand the class for that month.

As for changing the voting, it's not happening. You vote how you want to, in your head, then vote for who you want on here. I personally thruroughly look at every entrant before I vote. The car with the most done does NOT always win in my book. User attitude, user participation on the site, quality of the parts and work done, not to mention the TASTE of the work done, win my vote.

For example, I did NOT vote for Jack for COTY, he's never here, vague when he is, does NOT represent the site at the meets/shows he goes to. I still have his COTY SHIRT sitting in my office, because he hasn't given me the info to send it.

MONTHS later.

Vote how you want to, but set it up on your own. Do some tally's, see who wins your little vote off, and then vote here.

We use the IPB polling because it's built in, and trustworthy.

majik

I don't even vote for myself half the time. I wasn't going to participate this year, but I couldn't let DTN win so easily, so I entered.

Hive

I think that today's system gives th ebest chances to anyone.

and hey majik I never voted for myself instead I think that I even voted for my competitors to be fair (not sure though but I think I did).

Sparticus

i must admit that when i was asked by other members of staff that i did not like the idea of doing the setup the way that it is now. i wanted nothing to do w/ classes. i felt that it was fine just the way that it was. (RED ZMAN and i talked quite a bit about it on AIM).

now, however, i feel that in order to give anyone and everyone a chance at winning is best for the website as a whole. no offense to Redshark_Tiburon or DTN, but seeing their cars EVERY MONTH was starting to get ubsurd. sure, they can enter in plenty of categories (generation, anything goes, n/a [so 8 each], it will still give others chances to enter and not feel like they do not stand a chance against those who have a pile of mods on their car.

i do like the feedback on the COTM process, and take everything into consideration. ever since i started running it, we have seen more entrants, more votes, more consistancy (when contests are held) and more entusiasm as a whole with the contest. site-wide emails will be implemented more often in order to receive more cars and votes.

any type of change to the voting process will not happen. 1 car, 1 vote. no points.

DTN

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (majikTib @ Apr 17 2008, 02:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't even vote for myself half the time. I wasn't going to participate this year, but I couldn't let DTN win so easily, so I entered.</div>
LOL... I think I'm perminantly 2nd place. I think this is a good way of doing it. Dibs on November.