Off Topic Cafe If it doesn't belong in any of the other forums. Post all Off Topic stuff here.

What are your opinions about Unions?

Thread Tools
 
Old 07-26-2010, 08:43 AM
  #1  
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
217Sonatta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Springfield, Illinois
Posts: 219
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Vehicle: 2003 Hyundai Sonatta 2.7L
Default What are your opinions about Unions?

Im on the fence about the effectiveness Unions have, but this is an interesting article to say the least

QUOTE
From The Business Insider

Editor's note: Michael Snyder is editor of theeconomiccollapseblog.com

The 22 statistics detailed here prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the middle class is being systematically wiped out of existence in America.

The rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer at a staggering rate. Once upon a time, the United States had the largest and most prosperous middle class in the history of the world, but now that is changing at a blinding pace.

So why are we witnessing such fundamental changes? Well, the globalism and "free trade" that our politicians and business leaders insisted would be so good for us have had some rather nasty side effects. It turns out that they didn't tell us that the "global economy" would mean that middle class American workers would eventually have to directly compete for jobs with people on the other side of the world where there is no minimum wage and very few regulations. The big global corporations have greatly benefited by exploiting third world labor pools over the last several decades, but middle class American workers have increasingly found things to be very tough.

Here are the statistics to prove it:

• 83 percent of all U.S. stocks are in the hands of 1 percent of the people.
• 61 percent of Americans "always or usually" live paycheck to paycheck, which was up from 49 percent in 2008 and 43 percent in 2007.
• 66 percent of the income growth between 2001 and 2007 went to the top 1% of all Americans.
• 36 percent of Americans say that they don't contribute anything to retirement savings.
• A staggering 43 percent of Americans have less than $10,000 saved up for retirement.
• 24 percent of American workers say that they have postponed their planned retirement age in the past year.
• Over 1.4 million Americans filed for personal bankruptcy in 2009, which represented a 32 percent increase over 2008.
• Only the top 5 percent of U.S. households have earned enough additional income to match the rise in housing costs since 1975.
• For the first time in U.S. history, banks own a greater share of residential housing net worth in the United States than all individual Americans put together.
• In 1950, the ratio of the average executive's paycheck to the average worker's paycheck was about 30 to 1. Since the year 2000, that ratio has exploded to between 300 to 500 to one.
• As of 2007, the bottom 80 percent of American households held about 7% of the liquid financial assets.
• The bottom 50 percent of income earners in the United States now collectively own less than 1 percent of the nation’s wealth.
• Average Wall Street bonuses for 2009 were up 17 percent when compared with 2008.
• In the United States, the average federal worker now earns 60% MORE than the average worker in the private sector.
• The top 1 percent of U.S. households own nearly twice as much of America's corporate wealth as they did just 15 years ago.
• In America today, the average time needed to find a job has risen to a record 35.2 weeks.
• More than 40 percent of Americans who actually are employed are now working in service jobs, which are often very low paying.
• or the first time in U.S. history, more than 40 million Americans are on food stamps, and the U.S. Department of Agriculture projects that number will go up to 43 million Americans in 2011.
• This is what American workers now must compete against: in China a garment worker makes approximately 86 cents an hour and in Cambodia a garment worker makes approximately 22 cents an hour.
• Approximately 21 percent of all children in the United States are living below the poverty line in 2010 - the highest rate in 20 years.
• Despite the financial crisis, the number of millionaires in the United States rose a whopping 16 percent to 7.8 million in 2009.
• The top 10 percent of Americans now earn around 50 percent of our national income.

Giant Sucking Sound

The reality is that no matter how smart, how strong, how educated or how hard working American workers are, they just cannot compete with people who are desperate to put in 10 to 12 hour days at less than a dollar an hour on the other side of the world. After all, what corporation in their right mind is going to pay an American worker 10 times more (plus benefits) to do the same job? The world is fundamentally changing. Wealth and power are rapidly becoming concentrated at the top and the big global corporations are making massive amounts of money. Meanwhile, the American middle class is being systematically wiped out of existence as U.S. workers are slowly being merged into the new "global" labor pool.

What do most Americans have to offer in the marketplace other than their labor? Not much. The truth is that most Americans are absolutely dependent on someone else giving them a job. But today, U.S. workers are "less attractive" than ever. Compared to the rest of the world, American workers are extremely expensive, and the government keeps passing more rules and regulations seemingly on a monthly basis that makes it even more difficult to conduct business in the United States.

So corporations are moving operations out of the U.S. at breathtaking speed. Since the U.S. government does not penalize them for doing so, there really is no incentive for them to stay.

What has developed is a situation where the people at the top are doing quite well, while most Americans are finding it increasingly difficult to make it. There are now about six unemployed Americans for every new job opening in the United States, and the number of "chronically unemployed" is absolutely soaring. There simply are not nearly enough jobs for everyone.

Many of those who are able to get jobs are finding that they are making less money than they used to. In fact, an increasingly large percentage of Americans are working at low wage retail and service jobs.

But you can't raise a family on what you make flipping burgers at McDonald's or on what you bring in from greeting customers down at the local Wal-Mart.

The truth is that the middle class in America is dying -- and once it is gone it will be incredibly difficult to rebuild.
Old 07-26-2010, 10:19 AM
  #2  
Senior Member
 
Lazyshot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Vehicle: 1999 Hyundai Tiburon
Default

The majority of our labor that we outsource is unskilled and uneducated. Jobs that the public are not willing to do.

I don't understand why the evolution of the workforce is something people are scared of. It is natural for jobs to become obsolete, because it is the progression of industry. Outsourcing actually creates jobs within the company that outsources. It takes unnecessary work and sends it out of the country for the local employees to focus on more "important" and "critical" operations. Expanding that company.

This Liberal feeling of entitlement is exactly the reason we have such high unemployment. You have to flow and change with the job market.

Currently, my job is HIGHLY outsourced to India, China, and other East Asian countries, but I could quit my job today and have 2 lined-up tomorrow. How? The job is in high demand, because it is necessary and evolving. "Cutting Edge" Every industry has a "cutting edge". That is the wave we need to ride.
Old 07-26-2010, 01:53 PM
  #3  
Administrator
 
187sks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Lacey, WA
Posts: 12,515
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Vehicle: Two Accents, Mini, Miata, Van, Outback, and a ZX-6
Default

QUOTE (Lazyshot @ Jul 26 2010, 09:19 AM)
The majority of our labor that we outsource is unskilled and uneducated. Jobs that the public are not willing to do.

This is a false statement. It was true at one time, but that is no longer the case. A TON of highly skilled tech jobs are being outsourced. Jobs that would pay in excess of $50k here in the US and generally require a 4 year degree. I mean sure, not a lot of people want to assemble toys for minimum wage, but that is in no way representative of the typical job which is outsourced to overseas.

QUOTE (Lazyshot @ Jul 26 2010, 09:19 AM)
I don't understand why the evolution of the workforce is something people are scared of. It is natural for jobs to become obsolete, because it is the progression of industry. Outsourcing actually creates jobs within the company that outsources. It takes unnecessary work and sends it out of the country for the local employees to focus on more "important" and "critical" operations. Expanding that company.

Wow, you sure feed off of the propaganda teat on this one. Outsourcing actually creates domestic jobs? No way. At least not for most companies. Everything up through middle management is generally located in the new location. Sure, there may be more domestic upper management positions, but if you ship out 1000 production jobs, 50 supervisor jobs, and 20 middle management jobs to create 20 upper management jobs that is a huge loss for the job market.

QUOTE (Lazyshot @ Jul 26 2010, 09:19 AM)
This Liberal feeling of entitlement is exactly the reason we have such high unemployment. You have to flow and change with the job market.

The liberal feeling of entitlement? Such as the desire to have a job available for the majority of the people seeking work? Jesus...if you're supporting a family you don't have the time to completely retrain yourself every 4 years. Not to mention how hard it is on a kid if you have to pick up and move to follow the in demand jobs all the time.

QUOTE (Lazyshot @ Jul 26 2010, 09:19 AM)
Currently, my job is HIGHLY outsourced to India, China, and other East Asian countries, but I could quit my job today and have 2 lined-up tomorrow. How? The job is in high demand, because it is necessary and evolving. "Cutting Edge" Every industry has a "cutting edge". That is the wave we need to ride.

That works fine for young single people, but makes a lot less sense as you get older and buy a house and raise a family. Sure, your job is in demand today, but the odds are good that if it's already heavily outsourced at some point not only your job, but the others you have lined up currently will go to someone overseas and you won't have any option except to change careers.


I am not in the business of making giant corporations richer. That is not my priority in life. I don't give a crap about the poor starving people in India, China, or anywhere else outside of the US. The quality of life in the US is suffering because of the free trade agreements while the multi-national corporations increase their profitability. If the corporations are making higher profits but the average worker here doesn't see any benefits from that it's bad for America.

I am not interested in changing careers constantly. I want to gain a skill set and improve upon it as time goes on to move forward in my chosen field. With things going the way they are that's incredibly difficult to do. And I'm not talking about stamping steel or making shoes, I'm talking about traditionally profitable careers. I have been in the engineering field for 13 years, and I've been unable to find a job for 80 weeks now. Sure, my job hasn't been outsourced, but the economy is flat and nobody is doing any development within commuting distance of where I live. Since the real estate market tanked I don't even have the option of selling my house and moving to where there is work.

The only way to reliably support a family now is to either climb to upper management, work for yourself, or live on public assistance. I'm trying to work for myself, but it's rough running a business. The worst part is my business barely sputters along and I still make more than a lot of people working full time jobs.
Old 07-26-2010, 02:01 PM
  #4  
Administrator
 
Visionz's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 23,223
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts
Vehicle: 2010 Genesis 2.0T
Default

io.gif




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:44 PM.