Question for Random etc?
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Question for Random etc?
Random can you get back to me with an answer to this one. I have been looking at alpines turbo system for the coupe and they sent me this stuff back.
Good morning to you and thank you for the enquiry.
1. The current cost of the kit is GBP 1 500,00. Freight to Scotland
would be in the region of GBP 230.00.
2. Installation can be carried out by any competent mechanic and
should take him 2 days maximum (kit is supplied with complete
fitting instructions).
3. The kit is mostly bolt on with the exception of the decompression
of the engine. For this to be done the cylinder head needs to be
removed and a stainless steel spacer plate inserted and the head
then replaced and torqued.
4. The installation should in no way contribute to shortening the
engines longevity, if the decompression is done and the kit is
installed correctly.
After i recieved that reply they sent another one saying that the only thing not supplied was the exhaust system? does this mean i would also need to fit a new exhaust?
I have the 2.0 se coupe
Good morning to you and thank you for the enquiry.
1. The current cost of the kit is GBP 1 500,00. Freight to Scotland
would be in the region of GBP 230.00.
2. Installation can be carried out by any competent mechanic and
should take him 2 days maximum (kit is supplied with complete
fitting instructions).
3. The kit is mostly bolt on with the exception of the decompression
of the engine. For this to be done the cylinder head needs to be
removed and a stainless steel spacer plate inserted and the head
then replaced and torqued.
4. The installation should in no way contribute to shortening the
engines longevity, if the decompression is done and the kit is
installed correctly.
After i recieved that reply they sent another one saying that the only thing not supplied was the exhaust system? does this mean i would also need to fit a new exhaust?
I have the 2.0 se coupe
Super Moderator
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 11,851
Likes: 2
From: Rancho Palos Verdes, CA
Vehicle: 2008 Toyota Prius 2006 Suzuki SV650S
You will need some exhaust work with this kit.
All turbo kits replace the stock exhaust manifold with a turbo manafold.
This means that your stock exhaust would need to be modified to attach to the turbo manafold.
Since you are now running a turbo, you will be flowing more exhaust gas than when your car was stock. You will also want to REMOVE as much backpressure from the exhaust as possible, to allow the turbo to spin up faster, and flow more air (exhaust).
I would reccomend you go with 2.5" to 2.75" exhaust piping. This means that your stock exhaust will need to be scrapped/removed, and an entirely new exhaust fabricated. You should be able to keep your stock catalylic Converter, but it will be a restriction point, due to the fact that the inlet pipe and outlet pipe will be of stock diameter (2"). You can replace your Stock cat, but it would be an additonal expense, and possibly make your car Illegal in the UK. (not up on UK emission laws).
I would reccomend that you KEEP the the stock cat, and if it turns out to be a problem/restriction point down the road, replace it then.
This type of work in the states costs about $300, so you can probably expect to pay a little less in pounds.
Any compent speed shop, that is capable of doing the turbo install should be able to do the exhaust work as well, and should know how to do it.
I would reccomend that you visit your local dealer and purchase the Factory Service manuals (2) and the factory electrical manual (1). All together they cost about $110 us funds. Loan them to your shop when they do the work. Hell, Loan them to the shop PRIOR to the install so that they can estimate the price of the work.
Unless your local shop is familar with the inner workings of Hyundai's, this will save you delays by the shop, and possible hidden expense if they do something wrong. The books will also be a good reference to you in case something goes wrong.
Good luck, and let me know if I can be of any assistance.
All turbo kits replace the stock exhaust manifold with a turbo manafold.
This means that your stock exhaust would need to be modified to attach to the turbo manafold.
Since you are now running a turbo, you will be flowing more exhaust gas than when your car was stock. You will also want to REMOVE as much backpressure from the exhaust as possible, to allow the turbo to spin up faster, and flow more air (exhaust).
I would reccomend you go with 2.5" to 2.75" exhaust piping. This means that your stock exhaust will need to be scrapped/removed, and an entirely new exhaust fabricated. You should be able to keep your stock catalylic Converter, but it will be a restriction point, due to the fact that the inlet pipe and outlet pipe will be of stock diameter (2"). You can replace your Stock cat, but it would be an additonal expense, and possibly make your car Illegal in the UK. (not up on UK emission laws).
I would reccomend that you KEEP the the stock cat, and if it turns out to be a problem/restriction point down the road, replace it then.
This type of work in the states costs about $300, so you can probably expect to pay a little less in pounds.
Any compent speed shop, that is capable of doing the turbo install should be able to do the exhaust work as well, and should know how to do it.
I would reccomend that you visit your local dealer and purchase the Factory Service manuals (2) and the factory electrical manual (1). All together they cost about $110 us funds. Loan them to your shop when they do the work. Hell, Loan them to the shop PRIOR to the install so that they can estimate the price of the work.
Unless your local shop is familar with the inner workings of Hyundai's, this will save you delays by the shop, and possible hidden expense if they do something wrong. The books will also be a good reference to you in case something goes wrong.
Good luck, and let me know if I can be of any assistance.
Senior Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 263
Likes: 0
I have an Alpine Kit and suggest you go with a CAI, there is a rubber bend that in my case would collapse due to vacuum and lost all boost. I installed a 2.75 inch exhaust all the way back. The kit is for less than 2000 unless they changed so you need some work, it is also for rights hand drive and MAPS system. Be sure of this things.
My tib is bone stock as of now. sad.gif
Senior Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 263
Likes: 0
Turbo or non- turbo. If going turbo 9 to 1 is a good number for me, for non turbo I would leave it as it is 10.3 which is high for street car. The catalytic convertor is not that restrictive but I took it away. The major restriction on Tiburon Engine is the intake. Make that baby breath first.
Super Moderator
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 11,851
Likes: 2
From: Rancho Palos Verdes, CA
Vehicle: 2008 Toyota Prius 2006 Suzuki SV650S
Compression is not your enemy. Detonation is. Higher compression means more power from every stroke, so more torque and since Horsepower is torque over time, more Horsepower.
The Beta engine is LOOSLY based on an existing turbo motor, so the heads are really rather well designed for a turbo application. However, Poor casting, and poor pistion surfaces make the stock motor less than idea for high compression/high boost applications without some work.
In 100% stock form, the engine would be fine with 6-7 psi of boost. If you go any higher than that, you will want to lower the compression, and/or add a detonation retardant. (water injection or methanol injection).
To the best of my knowledge, There are only 2 ways to lower the compression of the BETA motor. The "best" is with the Alpine Developments head spacer. This comes as part of their turbo kit. I do not know if they would sell it seperatly.
The other would be to 'stack' multiple head gaskets on top of each other. This has been done in the honda and mitsu camp. The usual is to stack 2 head gaskets, but I have heard of stacking three. As the OEM Hyundai Head Gaskets are nearly bulletproof, I don't think you would have a problem doubling them up, but I would worry about the long term reliability of tripling them up. Doubling the head gasket should drop you from 10.3:1 to about 9.5 to 1. Not a huge difference, but it could mean the differnce between a happy engine, and a bent rod/shattered piston.
Think hard on what you want/plan to do. If you are seriously planning on going turbo, go with the Alpine kit. At $1900, its a steal of a deal, for a kit you KNOW works.
If you cant swing $1900, save your pennies, don't try to build a turbo kit unless you KNOW what you are doing or have the help of someone (hands on your engine) who knows what they are doing. The others here at the forum, and myself, can give you advice, and try to troubleshoot your problems, but there is no good replacement for an experienced set of eyes/hands in your engine compartment.
The recent problem Mario ran into is a perfect example. He purchased the alpine kit, had a professional install it, and still ran into a minor problem. The turbo sucked in so much air, so fast, it was compressing in the walls of a piece of rubber hosing, thus making the engine suck harder, making the rubber hose compress more..etc..etc.. till it eventually starved the engine for air, and he would lose boost above 3000-4000 RPM.
When he described that his engine was losing boost at high RPM, I was thinking this was due to a hose leaking at high pressure.
It was actually the above problem.
When someone who LOOKED at the engine, and examined how it ran(Mario), saw it happen, and thus knew what to do/fix.
It would have been near impossible for me, or any of the forum members to guess that it was a simple rubber hose, from the comfort of my computer desk several thousand miles away.
I have no stake in Alpine Developments. If you want insane levels of horsepower, 300 HP or higher, I suggest you find a DAMN good shop, or go with the Dragon Fabrications Methanol Turbo kit. When you think of how important your cars are to you, do you really want to "McGuyver" some turbo solution together and HOPE it works? And Hope it's reliable? and HOPE that it's going to produce the HP numbers you want?
There are a few of you out there who are capable, and more capable than I to create a home made turbo kit. I applaude you and and salute you, and will do the best that I can to help you, but keep in mind. If the most you've ever done to a car is change the oil and spark plugs, a home made turbo kit is not for you.
*Random now steps off his soap box*
The Beta engine is LOOSLY based on an existing turbo motor, so the heads are really rather well designed for a turbo application. However, Poor casting, and poor pistion surfaces make the stock motor less than idea for high compression/high boost applications without some work.
In 100% stock form, the engine would be fine with 6-7 psi of boost. If you go any higher than that, you will want to lower the compression, and/or add a detonation retardant. (water injection or methanol injection).
To the best of my knowledge, There are only 2 ways to lower the compression of the BETA motor. The "best" is with the Alpine Developments head spacer. This comes as part of their turbo kit. I do not know if they would sell it seperatly.
The other would be to 'stack' multiple head gaskets on top of each other. This has been done in the honda and mitsu camp. The usual is to stack 2 head gaskets, but I have heard of stacking three. As the OEM Hyundai Head Gaskets are nearly bulletproof, I don't think you would have a problem doubling them up, but I would worry about the long term reliability of tripling them up. Doubling the head gasket should drop you from 10.3:1 to about 9.5 to 1. Not a huge difference, but it could mean the differnce between a happy engine, and a bent rod/shattered piston.
Think hard on what you want/plan to do. If you are seriously planning on going turbo, go with the Alpine kit. At $1900, its a steal of a deal, for a kit you KNOW works.
If you cant swing $1900, save your pennies, don't try to build a turbo kit unless you KNOW what you are doing or have the help of someone (hands on your engine) who knows what they are doing. The others here at the forum, and myself, can give you advice, and try to troubleshoot your problems, but there is no good replacement for an experienced set of eyes/hands in your engine compartment.
The recent problem Mario ran into is a perfect example. He purchased the alpine kit, had a professional install it, and still ran into a minor problem. The turbo sucked in so much air, so fast, it was compressing in the walls of a piece of rubber hosing, thus making the engine suck harder, making the rubber hose compress more..etc..etc.. till it eventually starved the engine for air, and he would lose boost above 3000-4000 RPM.
When he described that his engine was losing boost at high RPM, I was thinking this was due to a hose leaking at high pressure.
It was actually the above problem.
When someone who LOOKED at the engine, and examined how it ran(Mario), saw it happen, and thus knew what to do/fix.
It would have been near impossible for me, or any of the forum members to guess that it was a simple rubber hose, from the comfort of my computer desk several thousand miles away.
I have no stake in Alpine Developments. If you want insane levels of horsepower, 300 HP or higher, I suggest you find a DAMN good shop, or go with the Dragon Fabrications Methanol Turbo kit. When you think of how important your cars are to you, do you really want to "McGuyver" some turbo solution together and HOPE it works? And Hope it's reliable? and HOPE that it's going to produce the HP numbers you want?
There are a few of you out there who are capable, and more capable than I to create a home made turbo kit. I applaude you and and salute you, and will do the best that I can to help you, but keep in mind. If the most you've ever done to a car is change the oil and spark plugs, a home made turbo kit is not for you.
*Random now steps off his soap box*