MSD Ignition Control
07-08-2002, 08:23 AM
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MSD Ignition Control
What are the benefits of this? I see them all the time, but never hear anyone talking about em, but everytime I see them I get interested, but never follow through with more then thinking about it. What would this w/ a Rev Control do? And where exactly would it be placed? Thanks.
07-08-2002, 09:54 AM
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I've been the same way about them. I was going to put a MSD 6AL Ignition and a Blaster coil on my F-150, but never took the time. Everytime I heard someone talking about them I'd go and look at prices, but then would slowly phase out of it. I've heard that they helped alot on older vehicles like my 1995 F-150, but I don't know about newer ones...
Spatch!
Spatch!
07-08-2002, 10:06 AM
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Vehicle: 2008 Toyota Prius 2006 Suzuki SV650S
For the beta engine, you would need to get the following from MSD
Tach Adapter
and ONE of the following
DIS-2
DIS-2 HO
Programmable DIS-2
and, if you so chose
DIS Blaster coils (2)
or
DIS HO Blaster Coils (2)
The DIS-2 is basically an upgrade for the stock system. It is CARB approved (50 state legal). The DIS-2 HO is a *race only* version of the DIS-2. It is NOT CARB approved, and requires the use of the HO DIS coils.
The Programmable DIS-2 unit allows you to adjust the ignition timing to suit your needs/desires, and it also has a boost retard function, and all kinds of other bells and whistles.
If you plan on going Gonzo, the DIS-2 HO, or Programmable DIS-2 would be a wise investment. If you just want to get the Max from your engine without going Gonzo, the DIS-2 should work just fine.
Don't bother with the programmable unit if you are going to use a Haltec, Motec, or similar ECU replacement, however, a Programmable DIS-2 and a S-AFC offer close to the functionality of a ECU replacment at about 50% to 80% of the cost. ($200 to $300 for S-AFC and $400-$500 for Prog. DIS-2, so $600 to $800 total). A Haltec EK6 will run you $1200. These costs do not include install or tuning for any of the above equipment.
I both Crane and Jacobs also make DIS (Distributorless Ignition System) setups as well.
The Jacobs DIS unit is similar to the MSD DIS-2. Not quite as many features, but it is mainly intended as a mild aftermarket replacment.
Crane has a nice HI-6DIS2 system. It is a cross between the DIS-2, and the DIS-2 Programamble. It will retard timing based off boost with an optional map sensor. The also have a *demand* timing controler that will alow you to retard your timing when using nitrous.
Tach Adapter
and ONE of the following
DIS-2
DIS-2 HO
Programmable DIS-2
and, if you so chose
DIS Blaster coils (2)
or
DIS HO Blaster Coils (2)
The DIS-2 is basically an upgrade for the stock system. It is CARB approved (50 state legal). The DIS-2 HO is a *race only* version of the DIS-2. It is NOT CARB approved, and requires the use of the HO DIS coils.
The Programmable DIS-2 unit allows you to adjust the ignition timing to suit your needs/desires, and it also has a boost retard function, and all kinds of other bells and whistles.
If you plan on going Gonzo, the DIS-2 HO, or Programmable DIS-2 would be a wise investment. If you just want to get the Max from your engine without going Gonzo, the DIS-2 should work just fine.
Don't bother with the programmable unit if you are going to use a Haltec, Motec, or similar ECU replacement, however, a Programmable DIS-2 and a S-AFC offer close to the functionality of a ECU replacment at about 50% to 80% of the cost. ($200 to $300 for S-AFC and $400-$500 for Prog. DIS-2, so $600 to $800 total). A Haltec EK6 will run you $1200. These costs do not include install or tuning for any of the above equipment.
I both Crane and Jacobs also make DIS (Distributorless Ignition System) setups as well.
The Jacobs DIS unit is similar to the MSD DIS-2. Not quite as many features, but it is mainly intended as a mild aftermarket replacment.
Crane has a nice HI-6DIS2 system. It is a cross between the DIS-2, and the DIS-2 Programamble. It will retard timing based off boost with an optional map sensor. The also have a *demand* timing controler that will alow you to retard your timing when using nitrous.
07-08-2002, 12:30 PM
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Tach adapter, yes. You buy it from MSD when you order the DIS2 or DIS2/HO unit. You need the tach adapter if keeping the stock computer -- but it's uneeded if you're going Haltech/Motec as the standalone systems can compensate for it with an internal setting.
07-08-2002, 02:03 PM
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Ahhhh ok...thank ya...yeh I'm going Haltec later when I get my QTB...I'm working out the deal with Shark Racing however it's kinda going slow with the communications. But I'm being patient.
07-09-2002, 01:15 AM
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I have to correct RED and Random on somethings here.
1: There is no Tach adapter needed for the BETA 2 engines. Just the BETA 1.
2: If you are going to get the Blaster coils from MSD you are going to need 4 not 2. MSD does not make dual output DIS coil packs as of yet. THe reason for this is that the all the BEtas motors use wht is called wasted spark technology. (spark on intake and Compression strokes.) You would wire two coil pack in parrallel for 1 and 3 cyl's and another one for 2 and 4 cyl.
3: I would not use the DIS H.O unless you are building a race only engine. With the H.O you will have the chance of burning out a cyl since this is really only meant for extremely high spark energy. ie. 500 + HP nitrous or 30+ lbs of boost from a turbo.
4: the programmable dis is a little too expensive for what you pay for it. The only exta options it has is the 3 step rev control. 1 for staging limiter (DIS-2 has), another for hig rpm rev limit (DIS-2 has) adn 3 the boost retard (prograsmmable only) the boost retard can be usaed if going turbo and want the ignition to retard at as certain amount of boost to prevent detonation. Or if you are using a dry nitrous kit and want to do the same thing.
If you want the boost retard fuctions and the fact you can totaly program the ignition curves (retard only no advance option is able to be done) you can get and SMT-5 piggy back ECU, and be able to advance/retard timing, progam the fuel curves, drive and extra injector (5th injector) have the function of boost retard, the same feature for the MSD windows switch for nitrous (nitours on at like 3000RPM and off at 6000RPM)
Now this ignition bopx is not good for anything other than nitrous or gas miliage. It will not improve your 1/4 mile times on an NA engine all that much. Maybe .05 of a second. But throttle responce and idle are much improved. And this is a must if you plan on going nitrous or boost. As this will allow you to burn the extra fuel you would be sending to the engine.
the DIS-2 unit would be about $300
the programmable about $500
the HO I am not sure of maybe $400
the SMT-5 is $160
the tach adapter I have one extra laying around since I didn't need mine. I will let it go for like $30. I think they are $50.
All products except the SMT-5 is avail at summit racing. http://www.summitracing.com
1: There is no Tach adapter needed for the BETA 2 engines. Just the BETA 1.
2: If you are going to get the Blaster coils from MSD you are going to need 4 not 2. MSD does not make dual output DIS coil packs as of yet. THe reason for this is that the all the BEtas motors use wht is called wasted spark technology. (spark on intake and Compression strokes.) You would wire two coil pack in parrallel for 1 and 3 cyl's and another one for 2 and 4 cyl.
3: I would not use the DIS H.O unless you are building a race only engine. With the H.O you will have the chance of burning out a cyl since this is really only meant for extremely high spark energy. ie. 500 + HP nitrous or 30+ lbs of boost from a turbo.
4: the programmable dis is a little too expensive for what you pay for it. The only exta options it has is the 3 step rev control. 1 for staging limiter (DIS-2 has), another for hig rpm rev limit (DIS-2 has) adn 3 the boost retard (prograsmmable only) the boost retard can be usaed if going turbo and want the ignition to retard at as certain amount of boost to prevent detonation. Or if you are using a dry nitrous kit and want to do the same thing.
If you want the boost retard fuctions and the fact you can totaly program the ignition curves (retard only no advance option is able to be done) you can get and SMT-5 piggy back ECU, and be able to advance/retard timing, progam the fuel curves, drive and extra injector (5th injector) have the function of boost retard, the same feature for the MSD windows switch for nitrous (nitours on at like 3000RPM and off at 6000RPM)
Now this ignition bopx is not good for anything other than nitrous or gas miliage. It will not improve your 1/4 mile times on an NA engine all that much. Maybe .05 of a second. But throttle responce and idle are much improved. And this is a must if you plan on going nitrous or boost. As this will allow you to burn the extra fuel you would be sending to the engine.
the DIS-2 unit would be about $300
the programmable about $500
the HO I am not sure of maybe $400
the SMT-5 is $160
the tach adapter I have one extra laying around since I didn't need mine. I will let it go for like $30. I think they are $50.
All products except the SMT-5 is avail at summit racing. http://www.summitracing.com
